No water or overfilling?
After spending the last two days studying the web and gleaning together a bit of info from here there and everywhere I finally sorted my dishwasher....I hope! So I just wanted to bring together my findings in the hope it will save someone else some grief!
There are many websites offering a dishwasher troubleshoot but non I found covered my problem although I stumbled across many unanswered posts from other lost souls in the same boat!!!
My Indesit D63 dishwasher stopped working seemingly mid cycle, water stopped entering and it just halted.
Many sources listed upto five common reasons.
Inlet valve was quoted most often for both no water and flooding.
Another Item was the float valve controlling water level.
First the water inlet valve;
I tested with multimeter the two contacts (with power off) and got good readings with resistance, inline with a good solenoid. (search web if you need to test this, many places tell you how) so electronically it seemed fine although it could still be mechanically faulty (gunged shut etc).
The next thing to check was the float switch noted by most places as a plastic device inside the machine that rises and falls controling the water level.
There is no obvious float in my machine but there is what was described elsewhere as a "guntower" just behind the lower spray arm which was the very first thing I investigated in the first place, I had previously unscrewed the top, noting as I did that the top did not screw up and off but rather the top stayed flush and whatever was under was dropping away! From experience always a risky thing cos you just know the bottom will drop away on the last turn and getting it back on will be a swine! Sure enough it did drop away, but there was no rising float etc as expected, I managed to get it back together by balancing just enough of the thread on the wall of the hole until I just managed to connect the threads.
Anyway, when I had pulled the dishwasher out to open it up i noticed water on the floor and when I opened it up more came out!
There was a float after all and it was connected by a tube from the "guntower"
However it became obvious that my problem was not lack off water - it was too much!
The float I found was not the float described as the level controller but a last resort anti flood cut off! Thats why no water! On higher models in the indesit range I know this creates a A01 error on the LED, as mine does not have an LED it just did its job but could not tell me.
Anyway problem was not no water it was overfilling triping the cut off. This was comfirmed by clearing the tray and/or holding the switch open! In came the water and I thought great! until it kept coming till it flooded again!!
As a matter of course I tested the float switch as if it had been the control float expected elsewhere, it was fine, opening and closing the curcuit fine.
Again searching the web the inlet valve is also commonly blamed for overfill as well as no water.
But now I had the overflow cut off switch in my hand to manually control. So I proped up the machine (on car ramps! just catching the edges of the machine - but making sure I raised the waste pipe by a similar level too!) Left off the base/spill catcher and started the machine.
Water came in fine but did not stop, it came through the "guntower" windows down the tube and and into my makeshift catcher (turkey tray!) but the "guntower" cant empty fast enough and the water rose above the max level at the bottom of the door and all over the place!
I pusher the float switch manually and it did its job - closed the inlet valve and pumped all the water out through the waste -saved!! This did however confirm that the cut off works as does the inlet valve!
So still no reason for overfilling, the only device I could see that could control the incoming water was the "guntower" and attached cut off float switch but this had to be just for emergency as there is no way for the catcher the float was in, to drain.
There had to be somthing else controling water level!
I guessed it could be somthing complicated such as a flow meter or timer controlled by the main controller (my wallet wimpered).
I kept searching and finally had a breakthough, virtually unmentioned on any dishwasher trouble shoot - an air pressure switch! I noted on another guys post he had got to a similar stage and for reasons unknown to him his machine worked again when re-assembled. But somthing had to have changed.
The air pressure switch! A small round device clipped to the inside edge of the machine low down with a clear plastic tube attached and two wires connected.
What happens is as the water fills the base down by the waste exit inside the machine one end of the plastic tube is attatched and water comes up against the tube pushing the air back in the tube, as the water rises the air pressure in the tube does too until at the right hight the pressure is such that the switch contact at the other end of the tube is triggered shutting of the water valve!
Now I knew what controlled it I tested it, first taking the tube off the water/waste end, I blew down it, the switch triggered, and no air escaped, confirming no air leak and switch not stuck open/closed.
I first tested it in place.
Started the machine again and at what I considered to be a good water level I blew into the waste end of the tube (disconnected waste end and blocked nipple tube was originally on, I also kept the end to be blown well away from any live wiring)
I blew, the switch clicked ..... but the water kept coming! - emergency cut off switch manually to rescue again!
I took the pressure switch off altogether to test (simple clip push in and push down to lock it into place) and 3 wires taken off too.
I used the multimeter to check the switch, using the centre contact as common, i opened and closed the switch and noted that one side seemed fine but not the other way, when switched I got resistance for a second then it fell away, i kept repeating and got the same.
At this point I did not know wether this was right (a momentary contact/signal) or not. But I did get the impession that there was water in there so I though I would dry it out!
There are a couple of screws that adjust the sensitivity of the switch and therefore water level. I marked the position of the screw head with a pen and undid it, five turns! Out it came and the spring from behind it leaving a way into the switch, I got the hairdryer at it for 10 mins then left it on the radiator for half an hour.
I tested it again with the multimeter and got a solid on or off on both side of the switch.
I put it back on the machine and noted the tube goes up the machine a few inches, is looped back down through a clip and then into the now un blocked nipple on the waste section (looped up section to protect from water, trapping the air I guess)
Reset it all and tried machine again, cut off switch in hand again just in case, as I heard the water entering I kept turning off at the on/off switch then opening the door to check the level, guessing that if it reached the windows in the "guntower" it was going to flood again, (you cant hear the pressure swith click cos the machine is to loud) but hey presto water stops coming in before it reached the "guntower" windows and we are back in business!
I ran a cycle (number 6 quick rinse) and all was well!
Then I started to put every thing back together! Tipping the machine on its side to put the sump/water catcher/driptray back on, I realised that putting it on its side to take the thing off may have flooded the pressure switch as may the mistake of not fully connecting the waste section earlier in the day when I cleaned out some pipe work. So I left off just the side panel to keep an eye on the end of the overflow tube hanging down onto the sump, I started it up again watched cafefully the end of the overflow pipe and with a long screwdriver ready just to lift the float and trigger the cut off valve again if need be (***be carfull doing this as the live cables to the heating element are right by your wrist, use a long wooden handled driver etc or better still if it starts to flood just kill the power the put somthing under the float to hold it open before getting hands clear before putting power back on to pump out water****)
Anyway .... no leaks not even a dribble from the overflow! Job done!!!
Other stories I read started to make sense now. People were saying their machines stopped periodically, they tipped the machine, water flooded out, hey presto their machine was ok again!
In summary, these models, and I guess others DONT use a float to control the water level - they use the air pressure switch, which does not like getting wet!
There IS a float and float switch (entrance being the "guntower" but this is purly a safety feature to avoid flooding your kitchen in event of a minor leak.
I am sure that a small amount of water will come down the overflow in normal use, there is just too much splashing about inside for some not to get through the "guntower" windows, plus more as steam etc.
I assume this is meant to evaporate away and looking at the stains on the sump it properbly does normally, however if you have your machine in a cold room, use it regularly or both! there may come a time when the tray is full enough to raise the float and trigger the cut off and stop the water, my original problem??? Maybe if I had done in the first place what others did, tip the machine, empty the tray, mop up and carry on again for another six months rather than me trying to investigate what went wrong, then maybe my other half could have washed the Christmas dinner dishes in the machine not by hand and maybe I would not have come as close as I did to buying a new water inlet valve (between £14.25 and £30 depending on the website!) as throughout my web advice adventure this was held up as most likly cause, or a new air pressure valve (£30) if I had not dried it off!!!
So by trial, error and a hell of a lot of googling! I have clean dishes and my cash still in my pocket!
I hope this long winded story saves someone a long winded search for answers.
In closing, tip it, mop it, keep using it! If you suspect the inlet valve, manually trigger the float, if you suspect the pressure switch, dry it, make sure tube is airtight (blow down it) and looped without kinks. And if you suspect the cut off float switch (which you wont cos its a last line of defence only) use a mutimeter!
Happy new year!
After spending the last two days studying the web and gleaning together a bit of info from here there and everywhere I finally sorted my dishwasher....I hope! So I just wanted to bring together my findings in the hope it will save someone else some grief!
There are many websites offering a dishwasher troubleshoot but non I found covered my problem although I stumbled across many unanswered posts from other lost souls in the same boat!!!
My Indesit D63 dishwasher stopped working seemingly mid cycle, water stopped entering and it just halted.
Many sources listed upto five common reasons.
Inlet valve was quoted most often for both no water and flooding.
Another Item was the float valve controlling water level.
First the water inlet valve;
I tested with multimeter the two contacts (with power off) and got good readings with resistance, inline with a good solenoid. (search web if you need to test this, many places tell you how) so electronically it seemed fine although it could still be mechanically faulty (gunged shut etc).
The next thing to check was the float switch noted by most places as a plastic device inside the machine that rises and falls controling the water level.
There is no obvious float in my machine but there is what was described elsewhere as a "guntower" just behind the lower spray arm which was the very first thing I investigated in the first place, I had previously unscrewed the top, noting as I did that the top did not screw up and off but rather the top stayed flush and whatever was under was dropping away! From experience always a risky thing cos you just know the bottom will drop away on the last turn and getting it back on will be a swine! Sure enough it did drop away, but there was no rising float etc as expected, I managed to get it back together by balancing just enough of the thread on the wall of the hole until I just managed to connect the threads.
Anyway, when I had pulled the dishwasher out to open it up i noticed water on the floor and when I opened it up more came out!
There was a float after all and it was connected by a tube from the "guntower"
However it became obvious that my problem was not lack off water - it was too much!
The float I found was not the float described as the level controller but a last resort anti flood cut off! Thats why no water! On higher models in the indesit range I know this creates a A01 error on the LED, as mine does not have an LED it just did its job but could not tell me.
Anyway problem was not no water it was overfilling triping the cut off. This was comfirmed by clearing the tray and/or holding the switch open! In came the water and I thought great! until it kept coming till it flooded again!!
As a matter of course I tested the float switch as if it had been the control float expected elsewhere, it was fine, opening and closing the curcuit fine.
Again searching the web the inlet valve is also commonly blamed for overfill as well as no water.
But now I had the overflow cut off switch in my hand to manually control. So I proped up the machine (on car ramps! just catching the edges of the machine - but making sure I raised the waste pipe by a similar level too!) Left off the base/spill catcher and started the machine.
Water came in fine but did not stop, it came through the "guntower" windows down the tube and and into my makeshift catcher (turkey tray!) but the "guntower" cant empty fast enough and the water rose above the max level at the bottom of the door and all over the place!
I pusher the float switch manually and it did its job - closed the inlet valve and pumped all the water out through the waste -saved!! This did however confirm that the cut off works as does the inlet valve!
So still no reason for overfilling, the only device I could see that could control the incoming water was the "guntower" and attached cut off float switch but this had to be just for emergency as there is no way for the catcher the float was in, to drain.
There had to be somthing else controling water level!
I guessed it could be somthing complicated such as a flow meter or timer controlled by the main controller (my wallet wimpered).
I kept searching and finally had a breakthough, virtually unmentioned on any dishwasher trouble shoot - an air pressure switch! I noted on another guys post he had got to a similar stage and for reasons unknown to him his machine worked again when re-assembled. But somthing had to have changed.
The air pressure switch! A small round device clipped to the inside edge of the machine low down with a clear plastic tube attached and two wires connected.
What happens is as the water fills the base down by the waste exit inside the machine one end of the plastic tube is attatched and water comes up against the tube pushing the air back in the tube, as the water rises the air pressure in the tube does too until at the right hight the pressure is such that the switch contact at the other end of the tube is triggered shutting of the water valve!
Now I knew what controlled it I tested it, first taking the tube off the water/waste end, I blew down it, the switch triggered, and no air escaped, confirming no air leak and switch not stuck open/closed.
I first tested it in place.
Started the machine again and at what I considered to be a good water level I blew into the waste end of the tube (disconnected waste end and blocked nipple tube was originally on, I also kept the end to be blown well away from any live wiring)
I blew, the switch clicked ..... but the water kept coming! - emergency cut off switch manually to rescue again!
I took the pressure switch off altogether to test (simple clip push in and push down to lock it into place) and 3 wires taken off too.
I used the multimeter to check the switch, using the centre contact as common, i opened and closed the switch and noted that one side seemed fine but not the other way, when switched I got resistance for a second then it fell away, i kept repeating and got the same.
At this point I did not know wether this was right (a momentary contact/signal) or not. But I did get the impession that there was water in there so I though I would dry it out!
There are a couple of screws that adjust the sensitivity of the switch and therefore water level. I marked the position of the screw head with a pen and undid it, five turns! Out it came and the spring from behind it leaving a way into the switch, I got the hairdryer at it for 10 mins then left it on the radiator for half an hour.
I tested it again with the multimeter and got a solid on or off on both side of the switch.
I put it back on the machine and noted the tube goes up the machine a few inches, is looped back down through a clip and then into the now un blocked nipple on the waste section (looped up section to protect from water, trapping the air I guess)
Reset it all and tried machine again, cut off switch in hand again just in case, as I heard the water entering I kept turning off at the on/off switch then opening the door to check the level, guessing that if it reached the windows in the "guntower" it was going to flood again, (you cant hear the pressure swith click cos the machine is to loud) but hey presto water stops coming in before it reached the "guntower" windows and we are back in business!
I ran a cycle (number 6 quick rinse) and all was well!
Then I started to put every thing back together! Tipping the machine on its side to put the sump/water catcher/driptray back on, I realised that putting it on its side to take the thing off may have flooded the pressure switch as may the mistake of not fully connecting the waste section earlier in the day when I cleaned out some pipe work. So I left off just the side panel to keep an eye on the end of the overflow tube hanging down onto the sump, I started it up again watched cafefully the end of the overflow pipe and with a long screwdriver ready just to lift the float and trigger the cut off valve again if need be (***be carfull doing this as the live cables to the heating element are right by your wrist, use a long wooden handled driver etc or better still if it starts to flood just kill the power the put somthing under the float to hold it open before getting hands clear before putting power back on to pump out water****)
Anyway .... no leaks not even a dribble from the overflow! Job done!!!
Other stories I read started to make sense now. People were saying their machines stopped periodically, they tipped the machine, water flooded out, hey presto their machine was ok again!
In summary, these models, and I guess others DONT use a float to control the water level - they use the air pressure switch, which does not like getting wet!
There IS a float and float switch (entrance being the "guntower" but this is purly a safety feature to avoid flooding your kitchen in event of a minor leak.
I am sure that a small amount of water will come down the overflow in normal use, there is just too much splashing about inside for some not to get through the "guntower" windows, plus more as steam etc.
I assume this is meant to evaporate away and looking at the stains on the sump it properbly does normally, however if you have your machine in a cold room, use it regularly or both! there may come a time when the tray is full enough to raise the float and trigger the cut off and stop the water, my original problem??? Maybe if I had done in the first place what others did, tip the machine, empty the tray, mop up and carry on again for another six months rather than me trying to investigate what went wrong, then maybe my other half could have washed the Christmas dinner dishes in the machine not by hand and maybe I would not have come as close as I did to buying a new water inlet valve (between £14.25 and £30 depending on the website!) as throughout my web advice adventure this was held up as most likly cause, or a new air pressure valve (£30) if I had not dried it off!!!
So by trial, error and a hell of a lot of googling! I have clean dishes and my cash still in my pocket!
I hope this long winded story saves someone a long winded search for answers.
In closing, tip it, mop it, keep using it! If you suspect the inlet valve, manually trigger the float, if you suspect the pressure switch, dry it, make sure tube is airtight (blow down it) and looped without kinks. And if you suspect the cut off float switch (which you wont cos its a last line of defence only) use a mutimeter!
Happy new year!
