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Pump position, is this mad?

Discussion in 'Plumbing and Central Heating' started by Justin Passing, 21 Aug 2017.

  1. Justin Passing

    Justin Passing

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    Some company has just fitted a shower pump for my mother.

    I suspect air is going to collect in the pump via the hot pipe, and it'll stop pumping water.
    The pump is on the loft floor, as is the cistern.

    I wouldn't have tried doing that.
    Am I wrong??
    (cold goes to pump other end, pipe not shown complete..)

    Salamander 50 pump.
    Mbath.png
     
    Last edited: 21 Aug 2017
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  3. Terrywookfit

    Terrywookfit

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    Is your sketch a wind up attempt.
    Last one I fitted required min 600mm head from tank to pump.
     
  4. jono_h

    jono_h

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    Salamander have a few pumps with '50' in the name, and one of them can be used when there's less than 600mm between pump and tank.

    More details on their website.
     
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  5. Terrywookfit

    Terrywookfit

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    In the sketch there is NO fookin head. Pipes are above the fookin water level !!
     
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  6. kidgreen61

    kidgreen61

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    Oh dear:rolleyes:
     
  7. muggles

    muggles

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    Salamander won't honour the warranty if it's been fitted like that, that's terrible
     
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  8. Justin Passing

    Justin Passing

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    OOPS
    I'm cr@p at drawering

    More like this
    P2.jpg
    The horizontal distance is 15ft from cylinder to shower. Pump is above the shower.

    It obviously doesn't comply, but has anyone known it to actually be a problem? It's air collection I'm thinking of.

    It'll probably be the cheapest regenerative "50" pump. He says (through another) that he's "installed loads like that not problem".
    I'd prefer to kick him out than get him to alter it, and get someone local to do it IF there's actually a problem.
     
    Last edited: 21 Aug 2017
  9. Madrab

    Madrab

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    If it is a universal (negative or positive) pump then yes it will be fine. Salamader's CT pumps with a U at the end of the model could be used is that instance. That being said, if the head of the shower is below the level of the cold cistern it may work with a standard (positive) pump if there is a min flow at the shower head to activate the switches. What is the model of pump?? If it's a CT50 then again as long as there is enough flow through the pump it will work. 2L/min through both If I remember.

    Borderline with that setup though and certainly the possibility of issues in the future.

    Air shouldn't be an issue if he's used a flange or if it's after the vent.
     
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  11. Justin Passing

    Justin Passing

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    I'd bet it's not a NH pump. Would that help anyway with the air-collection problem though - if it exists, which is the thing I really don't know? The pressure vessel would be connected after the air lock, so the pump would start, empty the EV, then pump nothing?

    The hot is plumbed from the old bath tap position, with levels about as shown (horizontals are under floor). No flange. Just had a thought, there's a basin tap on the way, as shown. If someone opens that while the shower's pumping, that'll be interesting.....:eek:

    Bet they haven't thought about the pump freezing in the loft, either.
    P2.gif


    I guess this would be better - thin grey box is "airing cupd", thin green line is the ceiling, thin pink is connection to an Essex if it really has to have one...
    It's not going to happen before mum gets smelly though.
    P3.jpg
     
  12. HERTS P&D

    HERTS P&D

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    Cold feed needs it's own supply.

    Andy
     
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  13. Justin Passing

    Justin Passing

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    (y)You're right of course...
     
  14. Madrab

    Madrab

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    yes, you're last 'drawing' would be the ideal with a suitable flange and it's own cold feed from the cistern as @HERTSDRAINAGE2010 suggests. The basin would have the pump's flow and pressure .... shower, if thermostatic should adjust.
     
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  15. DaveHerns

    DaveHerns

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    With the ****e electrical installation ( see forum) I think you need to get them back to do it properly,
     
  16. Justin Passing

    Justin Passing

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    Yes, but if I turn up, he'll go to hospital and I'll go to prison. I don't want to meet him. Comes across as "nice", charms the old ladies, but everything he said was a lie or wrong or...

    Mother is ancient and has paid most of the money. Another family member was there to begin with and the man sounded reasonable. Recommended, all fine on Checkatrade :rolleyes:. For now :sneaky:.

    I'd rather quietly, for her sake, get rid of the cowboy moron and pay someone to put it right. Most of the pipes are roughly in reasonable places, so not a massive job.
    I'm always nervous about Essex Flanges, but I've never had a failure and it may not need one.

    BTW I've wondered before about the joined-feed from the cistern. IF that's the way it is with 3" of 22mm pipe (I'm not sure), then it may not matter once pump's moved. As I see it the resistance to flow is not an issue ( compare with shower hose) but it would be slightly more likely to suck air down the vent. Yes? No? Missing anything?
     
  17. Madrab

    Madrab

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    You want a dedicated feed for hot and cold, this ensures that the pump isn't starved if another outlet was opened.
     
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