Roofing and sofit question

[Mick Leek]

Hi All,

Some of you may be aware that i undertook a self build extension project starting late September.

Well i am now upto the stage of tiling and fitting sofits and facia's. Had masive problems with an overly eager archietect who wanted the most over engineered roof ever drawn. I managed to follow his plans in the end.

My question is this, do i tile first or fit sofits and facias first ? I would have thought it would be easiest to fit facias first then felt and batton and away i go ?
Do i fit the facia level with the top of the rafters ? or higher, lower ?

If you look at the picture links you can see it has 3 hips and a valley

www.phenomenalfireworks.co.uk/images/roof1.jpg
www.phenomenalfireworks.co.uk/images/roof2.jpg
www.phenomenalfireworks.co.uk/images/roof3.jpg
www.phenomenalfireworks.co.uk/images/roof4.jpg

(Sorry cant suss how to just put text link without all the crap)

. Is this something i should attemp myself ? Please take into account that i have managed to build all this myself, drains, foundations, brickwork, and cut all the roof timbers. I am quite good at diy so i cant see nailling a few tiles to the roof to prove much difficulty.

(not trying to say roofing is easy and upset all you pro's out there)

Any pointers or help would be appreciated.

Thanks,

Mick

 

[Roofer]

Sorry Mick but I've got a bit of negative......

First off, the Solomon Islands looks more like Canvey Island! (or at least somewhere in Essex)

The easy bit is that you put the fascia and soffits on before tiling and the fascia needs to be 40-50 mm above the rafter.

Now the problems:-

The roof pitch looks low, I'm pretty certain it's too low to use the same tiles that are on the house.

At the rear the tops of the rafters are just about level with the window cill, you need an upstand to be able to weatherproof with lead flashing.

You will not be able to weatherproof around the downpipe and SVP in situ they will need to be removed, not a problem with the downpipe but not so easy for the SVP.

The render will need to be hacked off to get the lead flashing in and then re-rendered with a drip bead, difficult to make it look good and to not spoil the new roofing.

The back hip and valley are very close, a difficult job for an experienced roofer, for a DIYer......??

Sorry to give all this neg, if you have any specific question I'll try to help.

 

[Mick Leek]

Roofer,

I'm in Lancashire don't know how that flag got there,
Im aware of the low pitch (19 degrees) new tiles will reflect this and the new ones (redland) will allow low pitch. Entire roof on original roof will be re tilled at same time.
Window will be removed bricked up to allow lead work new higher lintel and new window fitted.
Rain water down pipe will be removed and refitted to direct water in new drain fitted at front of house and not where the old one used to be at side ( no drain there anymore)
Was planning to cut in the lead work BEFORE i started fitting tiles in order not to get new tiles full of dust created from sthil saw. I was just going to cut into render through into brick total about 50mm and instal lead, fit bellcast then re render full side of house to get a good match.
Back hip and valley are close (400mm)

I was wondering about the soil stack I have seen one in the same position as mine that had been left.. I cant for the life of me remember how they got around the problem of sealing it but they did. (I must remember to take my camera next time i go looking around)

Thanks for the info on the facia boards. i think i will attempt the rear smaller roof, see how i go. If it proves too difficult i will get someone in. At least it wont be seen at rear

Got quoted 18k from builder, so far cost is £6k with all materials and me doing all work myself.. I hate spending money if i don't have to

Forgot to ask, Do you simply rap the felt around onto the side when you come to the hip ? as in lay on front from left to right then go onto side roof a meter or so ?

Cheers

Mick

 

[Roofer]

You seem to have put a lot of thought into it.

Yes, just lap the felt over at hip.

Good luck

 

[SstammeringStanTheRoofer]

S..sstan here........
notice absence of birds mouths , how do you p..propose f.ffitting soffits at corner details???
Hips running out d..down below soffit levels???
w..why the corner detail m..made like that, hip rafters cut short w..ith piece nailed onto ends???
Redland R..regent tiles can be fitted d..down to 15degrees pitch.
How did you a..arrive at the angles for hips etc????
Would you d..do this for anyone else on a price???

 

[SstammeringStanTheRoofer]

this might give some idea

http://www.diydata.com/projects/fascia/fascias_soffits.htm

 

[Mick Leek]

SstammeringStanTheRoofer

Your a dickhead.

If you cant help then **** off.... sorry admin for the launguage but i thought the purpose of this site and forum was to help the DIY person who had never done this before.

BCO officer looked it over today and said all is ok so that will do me.... Cheers to anyone else who had any constructive advice.

Mick

 

[Nige F]

Soil pipe penetration........Lead slate made on site : along with any other trick pieces of flashing.using leadburning kit... .nice job so far Why you need birdsmouths with such low pitch Cut the wall first.as you thought, but you may need a roofer/oldschool plumber/leadworker to do the flasings properly....also as Essex Roofer said Hip+ Valley close.......lead lined valley perhaps

 

[Mick Leek]

Nige F & roofer

Cheers guy's. Glad someone thinks the job i have done up till now is acceptable.

I was planning on using a lead valley untill i went to the local roofing company who showed me 2 types of plastic ones.

One was simular to the lead one as in it leaves a valley showing, and the other one once fitted wasnt visable as the tiles butt up agains each other. The latter one sounded as if you would have to be pretty good at cutting tiles to ensure it looked nice and the odd rough cut would be too visable.

just need to get my head around setting out the battons now so the tiles all look the same... beleive it or not, i saw a new build estate the other day and the tiles looked as if they had been fitted by a 16 year old YTS... No in fact i'm sure a YTS would have made a better job looked as if a monkey had fitted them.. I will pop past today and take a piccie for you all to laugh at...

 

[Roofer]

Mick, don't use the GRP valleys as it will make the hip/valley situation even harder. Use lead on valley boards and totally board out the 400mm wide section between the valley and hip rather than battens - it will make it a bit easier to fix the cut tiles.

 

[Mick Leek]

Cheers roofer. Thanks for that.

When you say board it totally, i assume you mean a piece of marine ply from top to bottom and from the edge of the hip to the edge of the valley ?

Do i use a board that will be a simular thickness to the battons i will be using ? Also do i board the other side of the valley lets say a simular width (400mm)

I know i have to use a 100mm headlap but how do you work out the batton spacing so all the tiles have an equal apearance.. Also where will the felt sit ? on top of the ply ? or over the lead but not visable once pointed ? I know the battons usually trap felt between rafters and the batton but how do you do it where the lead work and ply is ?

LOL sorry roofer am i asking to much of you with all these questions.

Thanks...

 

[SstammeringStanTheRoofer]

All my points were valid ones???

Redland regent tiles can be fitted down to 15degrees pitch.
How did you arrive at the angles for hips etc????
Would you do this for anyone else on a price???

The second post contained a link showing eaves detail

your job looks OK, BCO says OK, but birdsmouth cuts give the roof its downward load bearing. Weight of Redlands 'could' spread the rafters out!

I asked, out of interest, "how did you arrive at angles for hips etc"
genuine question, I might have learned something new from you?

But far from being a ***********, whatever that is, I have earnt my living for years as a chippie, no need for gobbing off like that.

Last point was, "would you do this for anyone else on a price"
there might be someone out here who would not tackle a roof at all, you may be able to help, or do the job

I have broad shoulders and can take it, but no need to throw your dolly outa the pram

 

[Mick Leek]

SstammeringStanTheRoofer

I am NOT a roofer, builder, chippie, brickie or electrican. I design and manufacture electronic circuits for the pyrotechnics industry but my fulltime job is with Vauxhall motors..

The reason i came to this site was to seek help in a project I thought would be easy. I hold my hand up and admit that it hasn't been as easy as i thought it would be.

I take my hat off to the relevant trades people who specialise in the various fields i have just mentioned. I have a philosophy that once i undertake a project, i see it through to the end, hence thats why i visit this site to ask the experts.

I am man enough to appologise to you for calling you a ****ing dickhead but when you are working to a budget and seeking help from people on a site designed to offer help to other people who feel capable enough to undertake a job and then receive useless criticism, well im sure you would also be a little ****ed off.

Thankyou for the link in the second post. It has proven helpful. I agree your points are probably valid. the angles of the hip were set by the architect not me. i have worked to his drawings. We didn't want to loose too much of the light from the window.

I would NOT undertake to do this for anyone else seeing it is not my trade but YES i would advise people on the problems i encountered in order to help them.

I was advised my numerous chippies that birdsmouths were not neccessary on such a low pitch and after viewing many other roofs being constructed and the lack of birdsmouths i thought well if they are all ok then mine should be... The biggest problem i encountered was that all the so called joiners i contacted would NOT undertake the job saying it was too complex... My message to them is " well if i can do it and i'm NOT a joiner then you must be ****e at your job.

I am pleased you have broad shoulders and wouldn't think twice about buying you a few pints and having a good old chin wag face to face about joinery.

Sorry if i offended you but if you could and can help, it would be much appreciated.

Mick.

 

[SstammeringStanTheRoofer]

Non t...taken

"would NOT undertake the job saying it was too complex... My message to them is " well if i can do it and i'm NOT a joiner then you must be s***te at your job. "

I have to agree there, a complex roof for you, perhaps, but a chippie of many years should have had little problem doing it, specially off detailed drawings

I am out for a drink in a bit, will have a couple to top out your roof

 

[therealhandyman]

whens the bonfire?