Structural engineers role

[slider45]

Just recieved plans back from my engineer.

I'm having a 3m hole knoched in the side of my garage wall to open it up a bit. Bedroom up above so it needs a lintel fitted. One end is being supported by existing brickwork, the other with a PFC.

Question is - should the engineer provide detailed measured specs for the steelwork? He has instead specified that a steel contractor be called in to do a survey and provide him with dimensioned plans. I'd have thought this was his job? Sounds like more unecessary expense to me.

Is this the normal way of doing things?

 

[The-brickie]

I'm under the impression that an opening up to 3m metres does not need a SE's calcs, you can agree with the L.A.B.C. as to the size of steel.

 

[joe-90]

The Corus site gives you info on Catnic lintels.

 

[^woody^]

Just recieved plans back from my engineer.

Sounds like more unecessary expense to me.

Either way, someone has to design the support so you will pay for it in any case.

But if the designer is any good and cares about the client, he will specifiy a standard lintel (where possible) which will not require separate calculations - and at current prices cheaper steel beams.

I'm a bit concerned that you discribe him as an engineer, and calculating steels is the work of an engineer!

 

[slider45]

I'm a bit concerned that you discribe him as an engineer, and calculating steels is the work of an engineer!

No - to give the company credit, I do have a comprehensive set of calculations and diagrams.

Specifications state 178x102UB19 beam and 100x50 PFC with details of all necessary fixing flanges and bolt holes.

It just seems strange that with all this info I'm still being told I need to get a fabriactor in to design the specific dimensions (lengths?) of each beam.....
I'd have expected the engineer to provide ALL dimensioned plans which I'd then hand over to a fabricator who'd ask no questions.

cheers for your replies.

 

[^woody^]

In that case, you (or the builder) can just order the steel after measuring how long it needs to be on site.

 

[slider45]

In that case, you (or the builder) can just order the steel after measuring how long it needs to be on site.

Thats what I would have thought, but the plans have the caveat 'fabrication drawings must be submitted to engineer two weeks prior to manufacture'.

Aah well - we'll work something out. Could well be to do with the fact the engineer doesn't know the depth of the foundations without digging.

 

[noseall]

it seems that the engineer is being a little over-zealous.

once armed with the engineers specifications, all the builder needs to do is order the steel from his usual supplier, who should be well versed in the fabrication side of things.

it will only be a case of cutting the steel, drilling a few holes and providing some threaded bar and spacer for heavens sake. it's not rocket science.

 

[Richard C]

Sounds like he's covering his arse to me!

 

[robert99]

More like he is applying a sledgehammer to crack a wallnut.
Few structural engineers and architects have any practical site experience or competence, so hide their ignorance behind such get out clauses.

If you have a major steelwork project then he asks the fabricator to both check dimensions on site and check dimensions actually fabricated in the works - so that all parts fit actually together when erected. Being steelwork, trimming and packing out on site is not too easy and very costly. The structural engineer does not want any claims for extra site costs laid at his door.

None of this applies to your lintel problem (he should give a nominal size plus allowable tolerances) but the structural engineer seems not to have too much common sense to understand the difference in scale.

Getting the site people to sort things out will probably be cheaper as they know what they are doing and do it once without argument rather than twice with arguments.

 

[noseall]

More like he is applying a sledgehammer to crack a wallnut.
Few structural engineers and architects have any practical site experience or competence, so hide their ignorance behind such get out clauses.

If you have a major steelwork project then he asks the fabricator to both check dimensions on site and check dimensions actually fabricated in the works - so that all parts fit actually together when erected. Being steelwork, trimming and packing out on site is not too easy and very costly. The structural engineer does not want any claims for extra site costs laid at his door.

None of this applies to your lintel problem (he should give a nominal size plus allowable tolerances) but the structural engineer seems not to have too much common sense to understand the difference in scale.

Getting the site people to sort things out will probably be cheaper as they know what they are doing and do it once without argument rather than twice with arguments.

well said.

 

[slider45]

More like he is applying a sledgehammer to crack a wallnut.
Few structural engineers and architects have any practical site experience or competence, so hide their ignorance behind such get out clauses.

If you have a major steelwork project then he asks the fabricator to both check dimensions on site and check dimensions actually fabricated in the works - so that all parts fit actually together when erected. Being steelwork, trimming and packing out on site is not too easy and very costly. The structural engineer does not want any claims for extra site costs laid at his door.

None of this applies to your lintel problem (he should give a nominal size plus allowable tolerances) but the structural engineer seems not to have too much common sense to understand the difference in scale.

Getting the site people to sort things out will probably be cheaper as they know what they are doing and do it once without argument rather than twice with arguments.

fair do's.
Sounds like my engineer's report will do for the BCO and I'll just call in a competent builder for the rest. Cheers lads.

 

[JS123]

More like he is applying a sledgehammer to crack a wallnut.
Few structural engineers and architects have any practical site experience or competence, so hide their ignorance behind such get out clauses.

If this is how you feel and it appears that you are not alone, then why do you hire them. It sounds like you could do the job better yourself.

 

[freddiemercurystwin]

oops