torque settings for wheel (axle) nuts

[David P]

I need to change the front wheel bearings on my vaux carlton and have noticed that the torque amounts for tightening these nuts are 360 Nm - i thought it was a typo but no. apparently its correct - try as hard as i might i cant find a torque wrench that goes up that high to buy or hire - so my question is...

how important is it to comply and not just do them up bl**dy tight and a bit more. Id be interested to hear what a mechanic would do if there wasnt the tool available.

thanks in anticipation.

 

[IanDB]

How are you going to get them off in the first place?

 

[masona]

i cant find a torque wrench that goes up that high to buy or hire

Very expensive to buy, £350+ !!

Try looking at ebay, they got one now 700Nm for the next 3 days, see this

 

[keyplayer]

Slide a scaffold tube over your socket bar( and you'll need a quality socket set, at least 1/2 inch drive, and don't use the ratchet, far too weak) Remember the force required to unscrew them, and match it in reverse when reassembling. You may find the offside wheel has a left hand thread, dont know about your model. you don't have to be that accurate, but if you're not confident about the torque applied don't drive it till getting it checked. I wouldn't buy a wrench - you'll probably never use it again, but you should be able to hire one.

 

[AdamW]

My ex's dad is a mechanic and a good one at that. He subcontracts to garages, mainly Citroen garages, for specialist jobs, so he should know his stuff.

Now, when we were working on my car I asked him about wheelnut torque. He said to me "you really don't need to worry about wheelnut torque, just do them up ****ing tight". He uses an airwrench for them.

So, just so long as you don't do them up so tight the heads snap off, you should be alright. Otherwise everyone who ever changes a flat by the side of the road would have wheels falling off: who has ever seen a torque wrench supplied with a car along with the spare wheel?

Now, if you want to be a bit more scientific, you could just work out the torque yourself: 360Nm. Now if you apply the force at 1m from the wheel nut, you need to apply 360N of force. This equates to 37kg or 5st11lb. So, you could stand on some bathroom scales and subtract 5st11 from your original weight and push down the bar on the wrench until you get to that figure!

Using keyplayer's suggestion I reckon with a 1m bar you would apply about 360Nm of torque. So try that.

 

[pipme]

AdamW

Good idea for torque-ing using the weighing scales !!

I think hub retaining nut (normally singular per axle ) is the subject here.
Providing bearing pre-load.

Bit dangerous for 'wheel nuts' methinks.

P

 

[Scoby_Beasley]

AdamW

Good idea for torque-ing using the weighing scales !!

I think hub retaining nut (normally singular per axle ) is the subject here.
Providing bearing pre-load.

Bit dangerous for 'wheel nuts' methinks.

P

I agree, wheel nuts aren't that tight ! I used to mark up the slot you take the split pin out of with a dab of paint (and the hole) and re-align these on assembly.
Okay, okay I know you're supposed to use a new castellated nut but who the hell has ever bought one of those ?? (Oh, me, when I had me beetle )

 

[AdamW]

Bit dangerous for 'wheel nuts' methinks.

P

YOu know, I completely misread the original post and was thinking of wheel nuts. D'oh! (really need an emoticon for "durrrr" here too!)

I have a late model Vauxhall Astra and you can't actually buy the bearings separately, you have to buy a sealed hub unit. It is great in that you get it from the factory all set up and perfect, and it is incredibly easy to fit. The downside is that the hub costs £200 a wheel from Vauxhall (I got one for £80ish from a motor-factor friend at pretty much cost price). And to make it extra different, you need the ABS hub even if you don't have ABS as it uses the sensor for the speedo!

 

[jsmith]

My ex's dad is a mechanic and a good one at that. He subcontracts to garages, mainly Citroen garages, for specialist jobs, so he should know his stuff.

Now, when we were working on my car I asked him about wheelnut torque. He said to me "you really don't need to worry about wheelnut torque, just do them up ****ing tight". He uses an airwrench for them.

I'm afraid this man is an untrained animal.

50lb/ft is more than adequate for wheel nuts, only kwik fit monkeys do wheel nuts with an air gun (unless they use the a torque adaptor).
How does your ex's dad expect people to undo wheel nuts by hand on the side of the motorway???

As for the hub nut, really this should be done with a torque wrench, but if you have a 1/2" drive breaker bar, with a 3 ft scaffold bar a really good pull by someone of average strength would be pretty close I reckon!

 

[david and julie]

to be on the safe side and also possibly having to do the job again. i would take car to a commercial vehicle tyre fitters and ask them to check the torque for you after you have finished the job. it is a ministry requirement that they have these torque wrenches. offer one of the lads a £5 in his dinner hour. also the mobile tyre fitters have them too. dave

 

[David P]

Thanks everyone for your responses.

I did remove it using a length of scaff tube - and put it back on using the same tube.
I used a 200 newton torque wrench at 100, then 200, then guestimated the additional torque needed.
but am begining to think i should go and get it checked after reading your posts.

the most worrying thing is that the vaux's axle nuts aren't castelated nor is there any locking method - the w'shop manual specificly doesnt mention lock fluid for this nut although it does for the disc retainer and the caliper bolts.

I replaced the disc at the same time - cos the bearing came as a hub unit and it seemed daft not to pay the extra £20 for new discs.

only snag was I couldnt shift the brake pad pins cos they were too corroded - so i have new disc with old pads at the moment - any ideas how to get them out? and if it is possible to buy just the pins, or will i need to buy whole new calipers (dont you just love inbuilt obsolescence)?

 

[david and julie]

for the brake pad retaining pins try A P Lockheed stockists on google for one in your area, they usually stock these bits for different makes, its worth a try. When youv'e got the bits try sawing or grinding the pins in half,then bend at 90 degrees to the caliper use penetrating oil and GENTLY try to move the pins back and forth BE PATIENT! If they sheer off grind or file flush then drift out. I am not sure about your hub retaining nut but if you do use loc-tite clean with meths first. Remember, if you have to drive the car to have the torque checked it will negate the loc-tite if you move the nut once it as set. By the same token if you put loc-tite on at another location, then torque, then drive home you will have used before loc-tite as set, catch 22 really. Have you tried HSS hire shops for a torque wrench.

Good Look Dave

 

[david and julie]

Regarding the retaining nut. Sometimes if you look at the thread they have a crushed or cramped appearance on the last few threads towards the outside. Some stub axles also have like a keyway on the end and a special nut with a lock tab built into it, to drift into the keyway after torqeing. Either of the above would undo using a scaffold pole and you may hardly notice them. If it is either of the above they need new nuts on reassembly, which may be why the book doesent mention loc-tite. Just a thought!

Good Look Dave

 

[copperkingslynn]

did u get anywere with your wheelbearings on carlton i now having same problem any tips

 

[Stivino]

did u get anywere with your wheelbearings on carlton i now having same problem any tips

You really need to start a new post, this one's six years old.