1. Visiting from the US? Why not try DIYnot.US instead? Click here to continue to DIYnot.US.
    Dismiss Notice

What is "Smart" with electric goods?

Discussion in 'Electrics UK' started by ericmark, 8 Oct 2021.

  1. plugwash

    plugwash

    Joined:
    28 Mar 2004
    Messages:
    9,588
    Thanks Received:
    377
    Country:
    United Kingdom
    The difference is presumablly in the sooner vs later. IIRC with prepay you get cut off as soon as you run out of credit, then you can activate a small emergency allowance to get the power back on and then if you want to keep having electricity you have to pay. With postpay there are a bunch of bureaucratic procedures to be followed before cutting someone off, during which time they may accrue substantial debt.
     
  2. Sponsored Links
  3. JohnW2

    JohnW2

    Joined:
    28 Jan 2011
    Messages:
    48,603
    Thanks Received:
    3,189
    Location:
    Buckinghamshire
    Country:
    United Kingdom
    Yes, there are differences but, as you say, only really in relation to the 'sooner or later', and the extent to which debt can accrue.

    The 'later' can certainly be very late with 'postpay'. When my daughter moved into her present house, it has been unoccupied for a number of hears. I can't remember whether it related to electricity or gas but 'on the dooormat' was pile of bills/communications, sent quarterly over several years to the last occupier (who may have died), with demands for increasingly large amounts of estimated consumption, and threats of both legal action and 'cutting off' - but in those several years neither of those outcomes appear to have occurred (the supply was certainly not 'cut off' and there were no communications suggesting that any 'legal action' had ever been instituted).

    Kind Regards, John
     
  4. plugwash

    plugwash

    Joined:
    28 Mar 2004
    Messages:
    9,588
    Thanks Received:
    377
    Country:
    United Kingdom
    Right, but it explains why tennants were historically given prepay meters (either by suppliers or by landlords doing private metering) and why even today some people are forced onto prepay plans. There needs to be a way to supply people with electricity who are not considered creditworthy enough for a regular postpay contract which has the potential to run up substantial debts.


    I think there may be some rules to protect old/vulnerable people which make it very difficult for suppliers to actually cut them off.

    What puzzles me is why the pile of bills/communications was still there, I'd have expected the seller or landlord to have removed them. Was this a reposession or similar sale?
     
  5. ericmark

    ericmark

    Joined:
    27 Jan 2008
    Messages:
    18,558
    Thanks Received:
    1,743
    Location:
    Llanfair Caereinion, Nr Welshpool
    Country:
    United Kingdom
    Yes we lost phone and internet when mother died, but not gas and electric. All contracts ended with her death, and the people dealing with the probate also dealt with services. I wanted phone and internet, but I could not find a pay as you go contract, and did not want to sign up for a year or more but no real option.

    I did have a problem as it was with the Post Office, who tried to charge me for broad band after it had been removed by OpenReach. New buyers had got broad band put in with their name, and when their provider got OpenReach to install it, they also disconnected my broad band at the same time, but it seems they did not tell the Post Office who were my service provider.

    There was some confusion as I had complained about poor broad band and I thought OpenReach was repairing my broad band, not removing it and putting in new owners talktalk broad band.

    I would have normally had to pay Post Office even after I had sold house, but not when it had been removed. I did in the end get the money back.

    When I bought this house first thing was electric meter reading and set up a provider, my old house also a problem, seems due to living with mother we had hardly used any electric or gas in our own house, and the estimated readings had resulted in us over paying, they wanted to simply reduce what we were paying, but since going to sell house, that was not an option. There was really no excuse for so many estimated readings, meter was outside the house.
     
  6. winston1

    winston1

    Joined:
    11 Jan 2010
    Messages:
    7,138
    Thanks Received:
    550
    Location:
    London
    Country:
    United Kingdom
    This has been mentioned before, probably by you but this 1948 Tariff seems to contradict what you claim.
     

    Attached Files:

  7. ericmark

    ericmark

    Joined:
    27 Jan 2008
    Messages:
    18,558
    Thanks Received:
    1,743
    Location:
    Llanfair Caereinion, Nr Welshpool
    Country:
    United Kingdom
    It was well before the second world war when we had separate meters for lighting and power. I think from memory 1920's, but at that time no national grid, so hard to find information about all the systems in use.
     
  8. JohnW2

    JohnW2

    Joined:
    28 Jan 2011
    Messages:
    48,603
    Thanks Received:
    3,189
    Location:
    Buckinghamshire
    Country:
    United Kingdom
    Goodness, I didn't realise that you were so old that your memory went back that far :)

    I suspect that winston's point was that, contrary to what you suggested, for non-"All-in" tariffs in that 1948 document, electricity for lighting was a fair bit more expensive than for "heating/cooking"

    Kind Regards, John
     
  9. JohnW2

    JohnW2

    Joined:
    28 Jan 2011
    Messages:
    48,603
    Thanks Received:
    3,189
    Location:
    Buckinghamshire
    Country:
    United Kingdom
    Indeed - although I got the impression that when pre-pay meters were forced upon people by suppliers, it was far more often 'reactive' than 'proactive' - i.e. it is not so much because a consumer is 'thought not to be creditworthy enough' but, rather, because they had already previously demonstrated their failure to pay 'postpay bills' reliably, if at all.
    There are certainly 'registers' of such people, but those who repeatedly point out that suppliers 'make mistakes' would quite probably say that they are as likely to 'make a mistake' in overlooking that register as they are to 'make to mistake' of remotely cutting off the wrong person!
    It did seem a little odd. They were not literally 'on the doormat', but had been neatly stored on some shelves - and, even stranger, the relative paucity of 'junk mail' suggested that they had been fairly selective in what they had decided to keep (and leave there). The 'previous occupant' (to whom the communications were addressed, and about whom no-one seemed to know much/anything) had been a tenant, not owner, and we never discovered why it had been left empty for so long (5-6 years, if I recall correctly). I don't remember the details (this was about 15 years ago) but my recollections are that it had all the appearances of being a standard 'private sale'.

    Kind Regards, John
     
  10. Sponsored Links
  11. Harry Bloomfield

    Harry Bloomfield

    Joined:
    30 Dec 2018
    Messages:
    8,192
    Thanks Received:
    1,137
    Country:
    United Kingdom
    They were even different voltages. You had to know the voltage, to go out to buy lamp bulbs.
     
  12. bernardgreen

    bernardgreen

    Joined:
    3 Nov 2006
    Messages:
    25,806
    Thanks Received:
    2,568
    Location:
    Bedfordshire
    Country:
    United Kingdom
    There is a good read about the first electrical supplies in Greater London It confirms my recollection ( of being told ) that Leyton power station supplied 150 Volts DC

    http://www.metadyne.co.uk/pdf_files/electricity.pdf

    read because of the copyright on it.
     
  13. bernardgreen

    bernardgreen

    Joined:
    3 Nov 2006
    Messages:
    25,806
    Thanks Received:
    2,568
    Location:
    Bedfordshire
    Country:
    United Kingdom
    My neighbour's new TV is so smart it was accepted by Mensa
     
  14. JohnW2

    JohnW2

    Joined:
    28 Jan 2011
    Messages:
    48,603
    Thanks Received:
    3,189
    Location:
    Buckinghamshire
    Country:
    United Kingdom
    :)

    That must mean that Mensa don't regard 'smart' as a technological acronym!

    Kind Regards, John
     
  15. ericmark

    ericmark

    Joined:
    27 Jan 2008
    Messages:
    18,558
    Thanks Received:
    1,743
    Location:
    Llanfair Caereinion, Nr Welshpool
    Country:
    United Kingdom
    So building the national grid was a little long winded
    when we hear claims to have EV charging points and other schemes one has to remember how long it took just to get the National grid up and running.

    I remember holidays in LLwyngwril near Barmouth and they were still using 110 volt DC. In the main village it was not so bad, but outlying farms the volt drop was a real problem, and so they were looking forward to connection to national grid.

    As to what their contract was with local generating station I don't know, I was in primary school then so not really taking much notice.
     
  16. Harry Bloomfield

    Harry Bloomfield

    Joined:
    30 Dec 2018
    Messages:
    8,192
    Thanks Received:
    1,137
    Country:
    United Kingdom
    'The village of nine properties is located between Dolgellau' - Good family run pub /hotel there, we got into a habit of dropping in there for a meal when passing.

    It took several decades.
     
  17. clifford1

    clifford1

    Joined:
    9 Aug 2010
    Messages:
    255
    Thanks Received:
    13
    Location:
    Pembrokeshire
    Country:
    United Kingdom
    The give away in all the enthusiastic blurb about what a smart meter does always begins "It enables YOU to do ....."

    A basic starting point for smartness is what IT can do for itself, and perhaps tell me afterwards.
     
    • Like Like x 2
Loading...

Share This Page