Why can't I have my consumer unit replaced?

[jgreer]

I've purchased a Wylex Consumer Unit with a built-in RCD (part NHRS804BQ) to replace the old one in my ex-local authority flat. It is rated for a 3-4 bedroom home. I have a 1BR flat so I figured it should be more than sufficient. The old consumer unit has 6 wylex wire fuses in it, no mcbs, and no rcd. Two metal conduits are mounted on the top of it and three come out of the bottom. All conduits go straight into concrete floor or ceiling.

I hate this old box and want all traces of it gone. However, electricians are telling me it's virtually impossible to replace this old consumer unit with the one I bought. How can that be?

I was told "The board that you have bought for your apartment is not the correct board for your apartment. You can not just replace an old unit with any unit. You need to replace it with either a mantel or skeleton board. These boards are only supplied by specialists. If your board is a mantel or skeleton board that would be fine if not we would be able to supply you with a new board. The board will be a modern fuse board a crab tree split load. It will not be like the unit you already have."

I've searched the internet for "mantel" and "skeleton" and come up blank. I was quoted nearly 800 pounds to replace it. This is nearly 6 times the fee for replacing a consumer unit.

Can someone explain to me in plain English why my new unit won't be acceptable?

 

[andy]

Can someone explain to me in plain English why my new unit won't be acceptable?

never heard anything like that before. try gettin quotes from more people(at least 3). as long as it has adequate RCD/MCB protection and can take the load, then i cant see a problem

it mayb because of the metal conduit they said that. any chance of a pic of the new CU and the existing CU?

 

[ChrisRogers]

You'll probably find they dont want to install the CU you've bought, as frankly its a pile of sh*t, to be honest.

If you take a photo we can probably tell if you need a skeleton board or not.

 

[andy]

You'll probably find they dont want to install the CU you've bought, as frankly its a pile of sh*t, to be honest.

If you take a photo we can probably tell if you need a skeleton board or not.

possible. most electricians would rather get the stuff themselves. that way they get to use the make they prefer

 

[supersparks]

or maybe, just maybe, its because the situation in hand requires a skeleton board......they dont make them just for the fun of it.

my advice, is to get atleast 3 oppinions, and atleast 3 prices, then, pick the mid range price.

some consumer units in flats can be a right basterd to change, more so when the conduit is rusted, in concrete and is a tight fit, and to make matters worse, the conduit lock rings wont go far enough down the conduit, because the conduit hasnt been threaded far enough and you cant slide it down and off......then, trying to wedge it out, one of the conduits snap off.....

then your right in the ****ter

been there and done that and still gon the bumps on me ead from the blodey cupboard to prove it.


ps, wtf is "rated for a 3/4 bedroom house" supposed to mean?

sorry mate, dont work like that.

 

[securespark]

Is the fee to change a CU really 130 odd quid?

Not in my part of the world.......

As others have said, there may be a good reason why you can't fit a standard CU in place. The flats I know have a metal cupboard with a skeleton unit that screws into special lugs within the cupboard. I got Crabtree to quote for a modern replacement (it was a split-load, twin tarrif unit, so you can see straight away it is not going to be cheap..)

 

[t4msy]

I usually charge for a full day. Although it usually only takes a few hours to change the board i've been caught out in the past. Change the board, switch on and click, rcd trips out. Then spend the rest of the day trying to find bloody faults. Then the customer says well you gave me a price before you started. Its always easier to reduce the price at the end but nobody wants to pay more.

 

[Paul_C]

A Wylex NS "skeleton" panel:

Notice its the front panel, busbar assemblies, frame etc. but minus the outer casing. Matching up with some of the cabinets used in apartment installations can be rather difficult though.

 

[2scoops0406]

I usually charge for a full day. Although it usually only takes a few hours to change the board i've been caught out in the past. Change the board, switch on and click, rcd trips out. Then spend the rest of the day trying to find b****y faults. Then the customer says well you gave me a price before you started. Its always easier to reduce the price at the end but nobody wants to pay more.

Well, I have to say, it works both ways, if you quote a customer a price, but don't add on the usual unforseen problems costing more blurb, then really unfortunately, that's the price they should pay. In Inland Revenue terms, it's all about who carries the financial risk for a job, if you don't carry any financial risk for a job, then possibly, although I admit not in this case, you could be classed as a digusied employee, which open up a whole can of worms.

 

[securespark]

Hang on, lads: First - the law is clear here - an estimate is not a fixed price, a quote is.

So if your bit of paper given to the customer has QUOTE at the top, you have to do the work listed for that money.

However, if your's is an ESTIMATE, then it is variable.

Second - if you don't make it a clause of the contract that you are not prepared to pay for any unseen problems or faults that may become apparent once the new board is fitted, then that is your lookout. In fact, you should know about them, because you will have tested all tails prior to reconnection, right?

If you are changing a CU, it is best to offer the customer a PIR (for a charge, of course!). Then they will know the state of their install before you start work on it, and so will you. Then you can say, If this AAA circuit is reconnected to the new CU, it will trip the RCD, so this will have to be rectified before we can go ahead with the work.

It is fair practice to tell the customer if you feel there may be hidden problems that will increase the cost of the job BEFORE you start, then if you find any, to let them know what the problem is, what you will need to do to rectify it, and how much this will cost.

But we're getting back to that PIR again. How can you compile an accurate estimate without knowing the state of play?

 

[jgreer]

Can someone explain to me in plain English why my new unit won't be acceptable?

never heard anything like that before. try gettin quotes from more people(at least 3). as long as it has adequate RCD/MCB protection and can take the load, then i cant see a problem

it mayb because of the metal conduit they said that. any chance of a pic of the new CU and the existing CU?

I do have digital photos of the old one. I'd email it, but emails are blocked here.

 

[jgreer]

You'll probably find they dont want to install the CU you've bought, as frankly its a pile of sh*t, to be honest.

If you take a photo we can probably tell if you need a skeleton board or not.

1.) What is a skeleton board?
2.) Why is my CU considered a piece of poo?

 

[Scoby_Beasley]

Cynical me might say that they don't want to fix your £70 c.u. because they can supply the correct 1 (the same) for 3X the price.
But I wouldn't say that, as I'm not cynical

 

[jgreer]

my advice, is to get atleast 3 oppinions, and atleast 3 prices, then, pick the mid range price.

Cool. I WILL get at least 3 opinions.

some consumer units in flats can be a right basterd to change, more so when the conduit is rusted, in concrete and is a tight fit, and to make matters worse, the conduit lock rings wont go far enough down the conduit, because the conduit hasnt been threaded far enough and you cant slide it down and off......then, trying to wedge it out, one of the conduits snap off......

Mine is a lot like the scenario you paint above. Rusted conduits, going into cement, etc. What a horrible set up.

I guess I figured one could removed the old portions of the conduit, rethread it, and connect a new conduit to it just as a plumber would. Or... would you even need to add a new conduit to it? Couldn't you just connect the wires to it provided the insulation is correct?

I may be talking out of my *rse, though. I'm no sparky.

ps, wtf is "rated for a 3/4 bedroom house" supposed to mean?

The CU box states that it is 'sufficient' for a three to four bedroom house. Basically, I have 6 wire fuses on my old CU. The new one has room for 8MCBs. Not all of my 6 fuses are even being used from what I can tell. I have one for the cooker, one for the light ring (6 lights in total), and one for the outlets. I've added an immersion heater to my hot water cylinder, but that hasn't been connected yet.

Hope that helps clarify.

 

[jgreer]

Cynical me might say that they don't want to fix your £70 c.u. because they can supply the correct 1 (the same) for 3X the price.
But I wouldn't say that, as I'm not cynical

I'd hate to believe that, but they didn't come up with the term Caveat Emptor for nuthin'.