problems since new ch pump fitted

[meshach]

previous CH pump (oilfired CH) packed up after 8 years troublefree running. It was set on 3 (gather 2 setting is more usual). Plumber fitted new pump (Terrier TC5) bled system, pump on 3 (he said this is a slightly bigger pump) all ok for 48hrs. Then pump started an intermittent sceeching noise, quite loud. Plumber came back, bled pump, said it was air which had settled there. Problem has continued, I have bled rads several time and got some air each time from same rad. When pump is on there is a slight rattling like air passing through it and sometime a sort of echoy whooshing sound. Rads all heat up ok.
CH boiler is Danesmoor 15/19.
\Plumber did not do anything except change pump.
Any help would really be appreciated as he is now not answering his mobile.
The tech dept of the people who make the pump said symptoms were those of air getting into the system poss from pump not sealed properly. Plumber said if this were so water would leak out. Is this true?
HELP! I am a woman trying to cope whith this and give 100% care to my husband who is disabled. Can't cope without a warm house.
Thanks, anyone who can shed light on this.

 

[samthediyman]

Piping problem:
The incorrect piping is allowing a stronger pump to suck air down the vent pipe. Really a plumber repair.

 

[meshach]

Piping problem:
The incorrect piping is allowing a stronger pump to suck air down the vent pipe. Really a plumber repair.

thanks, but what piping is incorrect? On the pump? or somewhere else? can I switch pump to 2 setting?
meshach

 

[screech]

on an open vented system the cold feed and open vent pipes are sometimes piped round the wrong way but until a stronger pump (or pump speed is increased) it doesn't cause any problems.

The cold feed pipe comes from the feed & expansion tank, this is the one that fills the system and takes up some expansion, the open vent pipe hangs over the top of the tank is only for expansion. The cold feed should be the closest to the pump, if the open vent is closest then it can suck in air.

try turning the pump speed down in the mean time.

 

[meshach]

on an open vented system the cold feed and open vent pipes are sometimes piped round the wrong way but until a stronger pump (or pump speed is increased) it doesn't cause any problems.

The cold feed pipe comes from the feed & expansion tank, this is the one that fills the system and takes up some expansion, the open vent pipe hangs over the top of the tank is only for expansion. The cold feed should be the closest to the pump, if the open vent is closest then it can suck in air.

try turning the pump speed down in the mean time.

Thank you so much- this makes sense to me and as the CH setup is old-ish may well be set up the wrong way round. Have got pump on 2 now and it is of course quieter, no rattles or weird noises. Will wait and see how this goes and will report back. Suppose could always put on new pump same as previous one that did 8 yrs on 3 setting no probs (Grundfoss 15-50 I think). Thanks again, please keep watching!!

 

[meshach]

on an open vented system the cold feed and open vent pipes are sometimes piped round the wrong way but until a stronger pump (or pump speed is increased) it doesn't cause any problems.

The cold feed pipe comes from the feed & expansion tank, this is the one that fills the system and takes up some expansion, the open vent pipe hangs over the top of the tank is only for expansion. The cold feed should be the closest to the pump, if the open vent is closest then it can suck in air.

try turning the pump speed down in the mean time.

Thank you so much- this makes sense to me and as the CH setup is old-ish may well be set up the wrong way round. Have got pump on 2 now and it is of course quieter, no rattles or weird noises. Will wait and see how this goes and will report back. Suppose could always put on new pump same as previous one that did 8 yrs on 3 setting no probs (Grundfoss 15-50 I think). Thanks again, please keep watching!!

More news, guys, my nephew who is an engineer looked at the pump and the "plumber" has installed it wrongly ie drive shaft is vertical, don't they read the instructions? The previous pump was fitted same way which is why presumably it burned out after 8 yrs. Don't know if this is related to the air problem but getting pump turned around tomorrow meanwhile pump running quietly on 2. I am going to lie down with cold sponge on head now..........

 

[meshach]

on an open vented system the cold feed and open vent pipes are sometimes piped round the wrong way but until a stronger pump (or pump speed is increased) it doesn't cause any problems.

The cold feed pipe comes from the feed & expansion tank, this is the one that fills the system and takes up some expansion, the open vent pipe hangs over the top of the tank is only for expansion. The cold feed should be the closest to the pump, if the open vent is closest then it can suck in air.

try turning the pump speed down in the mean time.

Thank you so much- this makes sense to me and as the CH setup is old-ish may well be set up the wrong way round. Have got pump on 2 now and it is of course quieter, no rattles or weird noises. Will wait and see how this goes and will report back. Suppose could always put on new pump same as previous one that did 8 yrs on 3 setting no probs (Grundfoss 15-50 I think). Thanks again, please keep watching!!

More news, guys, my nephew who is an engineer looked at the pump and the "plumber" has installed it wrongly ie drive shaft is vertical, don't they read the instructions? The previous pump was fitted same way which is why presumably it burned out after 8 yrs. Don't know if this is related to the air problem but getting pump turned around tomorrow meanwhile pump running quietly on 2. I am going to lie down with cold sponge on head now..........

pump has now been rotated to get drive shaft as near horizontal as we can but due to thoughtless previous installation cannot get it quite horizontal. Also piping is horizontal, pump info says best if pump fitted to vertical pipe. Can't do anything about that! Bled some air out of 1 rad. Pump on 2 running heating only (not water)for overnight, and just a very slight rattle. No screeches, whooshes, or other weird sounds (fingers crossed). Would it be a good idea to get system degunked and flushed out when I have recovered from all of the above?
Thank you to the people who gave their help, i am very grateful.

 

[celinaaniston86]

Piping problem:
The incorrect piping is allowing a stronger pump to suck air down the vent pipe. Really a plumber repair.

Yeah! I'm agree with you! A typical mistake many home owners & inexperienced plumbers make, is using too small of a pipe for the circulation amount of their pump. Always use the same dimension pipe, or even bigger as the discharge port on the pumps.

 

[Agile]

I dont have much confidence in your "plumber" when he does not know which way round the pump should be fitted.


Reminds me of a ( graduate ) trainee I sent to a small job where the pump was fitted wrongly.

The installer was there and the trainee pointed the error out to him. He replied that he had "fitted hundeds like that".

The trainee immediately replied "you have fitted hundreds wrongly then!"

 

[Nige F]

[). Would it be a good idea to get system degunked and flushed out when I have recovered from all of the above?
)

Depends how much money you have to spare . If it`s working OK now with no major cold spots in the middle of rads - don`t bother . An " old system " may want renewing @ some time in the future - try and get an honest appraisal from someone who comes recommended by a friend/ colleague . Or me - if you live in Sussex

 

[David937]

This thread is from March 2011, hopefully she has everything working now!

 

[meshach]

Many thanks for latest post- everything seems to be ok now pump has been positioned as it should have been in the first place! And I have found a REAL plumber thanks to recommendation by a friend. Rarer than gold dust! Happy Christmas

Meshach