radiator / central heating help

[cherylsmith1982]

i had 2 radiators that wouldnt work.
A gas safe plumber (friend of a friend) came round to have a look. He told me the bedroom radiator wasnt working because the valve had blown and didnt seem to sure about the front room radiator. He had a fiddle with all the radiator valves, and cleaned a boiler valve that was full of muck.
After he had gone, the bedroom radiator with the so called blown valve started working as it did previously, and the radiator in the front room got luke warm for about 20 mins, went cold and is still cold now. The bedroom rad is still working fine.

I was going to do chemical flush the system myself to see if that would help, so i drained the system via the non-working front room rad, releasing air via the bleed valve in process. But for some reason, the kitchen radiator remained full of water, all the others emptied, or seemed to empty fine. So why did this one not empty? There is a drain part on the kitchen radiator valve aswell but its corroded/worn so badly it wont budge so i cant empty it that way.

Can anyone just by reading this shed some light as to why the front room rad wont work? I dont want to put the sludge remover into the system if its not flowing round properly. Would a damaged valve be the answer??

Please give fool/female proof answers only because i really dont have a clue about the technical side of plumbing and central heating!!

thanks in advance

 

[cherylsmith1982]

and would just like to add now...
when i turn the bedroom radiator off, the front room rad gets a little bit of heat in it??

 

[Hugh Jaleak]

Could be one of, or a combination of factors.

Could be the system is not balanced properly. (Basically, water is lazy and will take easiest route. Therefore to prevent the flow from the boiler going through the nearest radiators and back to the boiler, you need to force it around to the furthest rads by turning down the valves on the nearer rads. See FAQ's for full explanation.) Meanwhile can you turn off all other rads apart from bedroom and front room? See if these then get hot. If so, balancing may offer a cure.

Sludge could be blocking pipework, preventing the water from circulating properly.

Air lock, this should shift if you can force the water to the affected rads.

Kitchen rad. Do the pipes to it go up the wall into the ceiling? If it is a 'drop' from the upstairs, then will drain only via its own drain off point.

 

[tamz]

Cheryl valves don't blow, they do choke up with muck though, as does the rest of the system. He probably got them to work by closing off all the other rads to help push the water through. When he opened them up again they have stopped working therefore cooled in around 20 mins. What it did prove is that you have "some" circulation so a cleanser should work. It needs to circulate to be able to break down the muck. It won't clear a complete blockage.
When you drained the system did you open all the air vents? You need to do this to completely drain it.
The kitchen radiator not emptying is not such a big problem when adding a cleaner but it will need draining to get rid of the cleaner and dirty water that will be in it afterwards. The drainvalve probably will move if you try hard enough
It can be drained by loosening a nut on the valve and catching the water with something.
Use X800 cleanser, leave it in for a day or so, or Fernox F5 can be left in for about a week, and rinse out dy draining and refilling a couple of times. While the cleanser is in if the 2 rads don't start to heat close the other radiators to help push it through and let them go on their own for a while.
After you have cleaned the system add an inhibitor then balance the radiators. Read the FAQ's for how this is done, quite easy just takes a bit time.

 

[fullyuntrainedplumber]

I would ask your friend of a friend to remove the 2 rads and flush all the muck out with a water jet. While they are off circulate clean water around the system and exit it via coupling and hose fixed to one of the feeds into the waste until the water is running clear. Refit the rads, may need new valves. Then when water tight add the cleaner or sludge remover and follow the hints from the previous writers before adding the inhibitor.
A power flush is the best advice, but it costs!!!!!!!!!! The Family Gas Care Co of Accrington charge £300. Or your friend of a friend may have acces to the power flush kit?????????

 

[cherylsmith1982]

when i turn the spare room radiator off, my bedroom radiator gets alot hotter when its on full. when i turn my bedroom radiator off aswell, the front room rad gets a bit of heat.

so would i be right it thinking this is the best method to take for now??
firstly, drain system via front room rad, undo the nut that attaches lockshield to kitche rad and let that radiator drain that way - and yes it does actully go straight upwards so that solves that bit of my confusion!!
take all radiators off one by one and clean them out manually, replace with new valves all round (they all look a bit past it). Re-fill system and check for leaks. Then when all is well, add the sludge remover.
Can i add this by re-draining the system and undoing one of the bolts on the top of a radiator? wouldnt know where to start if it has to go in via the boiler.

Then however long later drain several times to flush the chemical out, and then add the inhibitor?

thanks for all your help

 

[cherylsmith1982]

and just to add, i know the power flush is probably the best method to take but being the only person in the house i'd rather try and save the cash and do the job myself if its possible.
just keeping that as my plan b for now. and plus with having dodgy valves they would all need replacing before i had that done to prevent any leaks so if the valves have got to come off, i may aswell attempt to clean the sludge out while i am at it
been quoted £280 for the power flush to be done plus an extra £100 for the valves to be replaced

 

[tamz]

been quoted £280 for the power flush to be done plus an extra £100 for the valves to be replaced

He is not robbing you at that.

You seem to have a fair idea of what to do so go for it.

Chemicals can be added through a rad.

 

[cherylsmith1982]

i know its a fair price that i've been quoted but its always better still when you can get it done yourself for a fraction of that cost

a few days ago i didnt have a clue what i was supposed to do or where to start but after fiddling and risking making the job 10 times worse! i seemed to have half figured out what i needed to do.

I just needed reassurance i guess, and wanted to get a better idea of whether or not it was likely to be the valves or sludge, or both.

The next task will hopefully be balancing the rads as i have messed with them that much!!

thanks again![/quote]

 

[tamz]

You won't be able to balance them properly until you clean the system out

 

[fullyuntrainedplumber]

I don't blame you for wanting to save cash, best to use the chemical method as the other guys suggest.
I am just wondering if the problem radiators are not piped individually to the system manifold. Has the system ever been perfect??????? or is this just a problem of late????
What do the other guys think of the manifold idea????????
If it is an old type boiler and has a header tank it's a good idea to check this tank for sludge!!!!!
Would not worry about balancing until system appears to be clean.
Which pipe is used on the system? 8mm / 10mm / 15mm??????????