British Gas, rads and overflow issue (one for the experts!)

jimbo2112 · 1 Jul 2008

Hi All,

Have a boiler, 1993 non- combi - Prima F
New hot water tank

British Gas cover 400 (they have tried to insist I get a power flush, oh yes, that old commission based chestnut)

Problems: Hot water in rads when only hot water for tank is required (motorised valve faulty?)

Overflow chucks water out from attic for many hours a day whether the heating is on or off (though does seem to influence this at times)

All related issues?

Have had a new HW tank fitted and raised the breather pipes in attic as they were too low, but I think the overflow happens via the breather pipe as well as coming back up through the system from below ... confusing I know ...

British Gas keep banging on about the power flush and have been quite aggressive, I think I will get them to fix this and then jack them in.

So ... wht do you all think the issue is?

Cheers

Jimbo

nickso · 1 Jul 2008

is the water in the system dirty?
were you advised to flush before any of these problems arose?
have you got a three port or two two port valves?
is the pump noisy?
did BG fit the cylinder and alter the pipework?

could be a fair few issues here including the pump and pipework configuration or possibly blockages in the pipework. probably not an easy one to diagnose from a computer as there is quite a lot going on there.

simple facts are if its clogged with debris and corrosion you need to have it flushed out. yes BG can be a little quick to suggest it but its in your t+c's and if its dirty it needs doing. if it is badly sludged then faulty valves,pumps and blockages that are as a direct result of that corrosion are not covered for repair, again its in your t+c's. they should however have the system running if you were not advised about water quality before the issues arose.

jimbo2112 · 1 Jul 2008

System water not dirty

Not advised to flush (problem has been seen by 4/5 BG blookes and only 1 half wit has insisted on this, everyone else has to then agree else BG loses face)

How can I tell how many port valves I have?

I have a 4 bar pump which the last house owner installed and it does more than just the shower! Most taps and all 3 toilets run off it!

BG fitted the cylinder and pipework

nickso · 1 Jul 2008

jimbo2112 said:
System water not dirty

Not advised to flush (problem has been seen by 4/5 BG blookes and only 1 half wit has insisted on this, everyone else has to then agree else BG loses face)

How can I tell how many port valves I have?

I have a 4 bar pump which the last house owner installed and it does more than just the shower! Most taps and all 3 toilets run off it!

BG fitted the cylinder and pipework

if the system water is not dirty and there are no blockages then you have to ask them why its required. not all BG guys are going to blindly back up the previous guy just cos he works for the same company, i dont do it. if you have a problem that is not being resolved by the engineers without satisfactory explanation then you need to start a complaint and get the TSM involved.

which tank are we on about here? it now sounds like you are talking about the cylinder side of things.

which tank is overflowing, the small one or the big one? if its the shower pump that is causing it that is not covered under your t+c's unless its as a direct result of the work done to pipe the new cylinder.

jimbo2112 · 1 Jul 2008

I want them to exhaust every possibility before going down the PF route though. They don't seem to want to do this. Hopefully tomorrow will show the electric valve to be the cause for this (with no sludge involved!)

ollski · 1 Jul 2008

No they I will back up nickso here that they won't blindly back a collegue up

If you have concerns as to the need for a powerflush ask for a water sample which is analyzed by sentinel and totally independent.

twgas · 1 Jul 2008

I cant beleive you've had this pumping over problem for some time, (4/5 engineer visits) and your system is still clean,

The motorised valve is not going to cause pumping over, but the pumping over will cause the sludge that nakkers the motorised valve

perhaps the "1 half wit" was the best engineer you've had!

oakland99 · 1 Jul 2008

here here twgas if the systems pumping over then feed and vent is blocked or incorrectly piped in and if its been pumping over for ages then you will have sludge probs, this is due to fresh water continuously being put into system, to make up for water pumping out, this causes oxidization and sludge probs. If you don't like the advice B.G are giving leave and go elsewere.

Garfeild · 1 Jul 2008

I have a 4 bar pump which the last house owner installed and it does more than just the shower! Most taps and all 3 toilets run off it!

Agile · 3 Jul 2008

I hope that you realise that if a BG man says that it needs a power flush then he is out of the house in 10 minutes and might get home early for a round of golf!

For business reasons if one person has suggested an expensive cure then no others are going to strongly disagree.

I once did a power flush because BG had asked for one. The system was very clean and my flushing was a waste of time ( and £400 ) but it got their system cover reinstated and I went away happy.

Tony

nickso · 3 Jul 2008

here we go, mr factual rolls back in

Agile said:
I hope that you realise that if a BG man says that it needs a power flush then he is out of the house in 10 minutes and might get home early for a round of golf!

this from experience is it? perhaps if he recommends a PF its because the system needs it? the OP has said it is clean but doesnt say how he knows or how its managed to pump over for so long and stay clean. the facts are a PF is more often than not recommended with no other action taken because the customer has already been advised to do it and hasnt thereby invalidating certain parts of his contract. if the system is dirty it needs flushing. if it isnt and an independant test comes back recommending a flush, it needs flushed.
when are you going to get it into your head that what a BG engineer does on a daily basis is vastly different from your job?

For business reasons if one person has suggested an expensive cure then no others are going to strongly disagree.

wrong. we have already discussed that. it doesnt happen all the time.

I once did a power flush because BG had asked for one. The system was very clean and my flushing was a waste of time ( and £400 ) but it got their system cover reinstated and I went away happy.

did they tell you why it needed doing?

Agile · 3 Jul 2008

nickso said:
I once did a power flush because BG had asked for one. The system was very clean and my flushing was a waste of time ( and £400 ) but it got their system cover reinstated and I went away happy.

Click to expand...

did they tell you why it needed doing?

I was called by the householder who had been told by BG that the system needed powerflushing to continue the cover and they had been quoted about £800 ( as its a large house ). There did not seem to be any problem with the system at all. All very clean including the header tank!

Tony

nickso · 3 Jul 2008

Agile said:
nickso said:

I once did a power flush because BG had asked for one. The system was very clean and my flushing was a waste of time ( and £400 ) but it got their system cover reinstated and I went away happy.

Click to expand...

did they tell you why it needed doing?

Click to expand...

I was called by the householder who had been told by BG that the system needed powerflushing to continue the cover and they had been quoted about £800 ( as its a large house ). There did not seem to be any problem with the system at all. All very clean including the header tank!

Tony

so, no, they didnt tell you.

superdupergasman · 3 Jul 2008

If you read the description of what is included in the powerflush it is not a simple flush of the radiators, the source of the problem is resolved, ie redoing cold feed, expansion to a close coupled cofig etc.

There is very few occassions that a flush is all they do.

GodKnows · 3 Jul 2008

I think ur problem is the 4bar pump, the overflow pipe obviously dumping excess water due to the extreme pressure that the 4bar pump is shovong through your house. Can't understand why it is connected via your cold feed coming into house (assuming what you have said) so all cold feed draw-offs is gallaping out! You mustn't be on a water meter then!!

Suggest u trun down your flow on pump and fit new ball valves in tanks, then look at div valve, see if it adjusts manually and get someone to turn controls off + on whilst you are looking at div valve to see if it operates or use a multi-meter to check for voltage etc...

My guarantee is the red light on the van

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British Gas, rads and overflow issue (one for the experts!)

oakland99

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