Car charging installation

[ncoups]

The installation for this confuses me a little bit, is there some kind of different distribution system with 2 lines in america?
There arent any installation instructions for the UK, would i be right in thinking that the installation in UK would be just live and neutral instead of l1 and l2 and the three phase installation would just be redundant?

http://www.teslamotors.com/electric/ /display_data/home_connector_installation.pdf

 

[TheOriginalTonkaToy]

Basically, yes.

America uses a 110v split phase system with a centre tapped transformer as shown in the diagrams. This produces 2 110v lines at 180 degree phase that can be summed to give 220v if necessary.

 

[ericmark]

There are four points.
1) It has an earth (ground) monitoring device this may not work with British system and may not comply with regulations we would normally use a automatic disconnection device not just monitoring.
2) It says it requires a centre tap to earth to do this would need an expensive isolation transformer to do with UK wiring.
3) It needs 90 amps this means a dedicated supply not just connected to standard house supply unless everything else is turned off.
4) It runs on 60Hz not 50Hz running at lower Hz can cause over heating and you would need to check with manufacture. But if 60Hz is required then that's a really big inverter not cheap.

From the pictures it looks like a transformer and you may be able to use in UK but the part which says you should not use a GFCI (ground fault circuit interrupter) in UK these are called RCD's makes me wonder if there is some circuit I can't see and I would want to do some very careful inspection and testing before I used that unit.

I do note this quarters IET Wiring Matters is referring to proposed standards for charging electric vehicles. Not got my copy to hand but seems there will soon be some standardisation but hardly helps you.

 

[slup]

I would be most wary of connecting this to a 50Hz supply....

The other big issue is that the charger circuit is actually part of the car - the unit you linked to is nothing more than a monitoring device with a contactor in it.

I'm guessing you put the plug in, the car has a quick chat with the wall unit and if everything is OK, the contactor closes. There is probably a make last / break first pin on the charger plug which makes sure the contactor disconnects the supply before you fully remove the plug.

The upshot of all this is that if you blow it up by connecting it to a 50Hz supply, it's your car that you have knackered and not the 'charger'.

Steve

 

[slup]

Tesla UK

01753 626782

Best call them!

 

[TheOriginalTonkaToy]

I'd assumed this was just a "how does this work?" type query

 

[bernardgreen]

I'd assumed this was just a "how does this work?" type query

The mention of a concern when an item designed to work on 60Hz is being used on 50Hz is valid. If there is a motor, choke, transformer or other inductive device specified to work at 60Hz then the item may work less efficiently at 50Hz where impedances will be different to those at 60Hz Also eddy currents in magnetic cores and other losses may cause excessive heating when the item is operated at 50Hz.

 

[TheOriginalTonkaToy]

I'd assumed this was just a "how does this work?" type query

The mention of a concern when an item designed to work on 60Hz is being used on 50Hz is valid. If there is a motor, choke, transformer or other inductive device specified to work at 60Hz then the item may work less efficiently at 50Hz where impedances will be different to those at 60Hz Also eddy currents in magnetic cores and other losses may cause excessive heating when the item is operated at 50Hz.

I know that. I'd assumed that the OP was asking how the US system worked. I'd have thought that these systems would be installed and tested by the suppliers or other specialists. The was at the thought that he might not be.

 

[ncoups]

it was just out of curiosity, i quite fancy a tesla S and a browse on the website led me to the installation docs.

 

[timtheenchanter]

they had a Tesla on the last series of Top-Gear it was the Roadster iirc, and Im 99.9%sure they showed Clarkson plugging the Tesla into a normal 13A outlet.

 

[ncoups]

thats the very slow emergancy/travel charger

 

[Steve]

Would love to see the sparks and arcs when the plug is removed from the car while 90 amps is flowing!

 

[ericmark]

I am sure if you can afford the car they would build you a charger to UK speck as they are all made to customers spec. I understand there was a real Nikola Tesla car made but there is nothing concrete as to if it really worked or one of the Tesla myths! He was experimenting into radio power transmittance and did have some success with wireless transmittance of power. The car was reputed to be a continuation of this and to work by receiving the transmitted power.
But genius and madness are very close and no one today quite knows what was fact and what was fiction.

However the power requirements do point out the problems with electric power and even the electric fork lift needs around a 32A supply to recharge and the design of the charger means that rate is constant for a good few hours before the second stage kicks in.

Page 4 Wiring Matters Winter 09 refers to using a 16A socket but my rough calculations give 1 Litre of Petrol = 18Kw/Hours so with a journey in my little car to London from North Wales in my little car needing approx 15 Litres then that's around 74 hours to recharge at 16A compare that with the 5 minutes to fill with 15 Litres of petrol and you can see the problems.

Yes I know regenerative breaking will save some power and the electric battery is slightly more efficient than the petrol engine but with a 16A charge rate the range of an electric car is limited to around 50 miles per day assuming 12 hours charge. Lift charge rate to 90A instead of 16A and you get to around the 300 miles per day.

So being realistic 32A supply would really be required to recharge a 16A supply would only really top-up.

Come back Sir Clive Sinclair all is forgiven! He got it right all those years ago the only way to use electric transport is either very small i.e. electric bike or with mains power i.e. the tram.

 

[TheOriginalTonkaToy]

Hydrogen fuel cells are the way forward if they can crack the production cost issues.

 

[brig001]

Hydrogen fuel cells are the way forward if they can crack the production cost issues.

Might be if:
a) they can split hydrogen from water efficiently - no sign yet - but you never know.
b) you could store it for more than a week in a vehicle - big problem because it leaks out of any practical container because the molecules are so small.