Central heating and water not working at all

[aprilseven]

Hi,
Glad you got things sorted Sarahe. A huge relief!
Exactly the same thing happened to me this evening (new Baxi combi installed last December). I've disconnected condensate pipe at bottom of boiler and it's dripping into a bucket. Not much point in trying to thaw pipes outside as it's -13 degrees and will be for the next few days!! Apart from lagging pipes (which has been done), is there any other way to prevent this or will this be a yearly winter event? Bit of a pain and I'm afraid that reoccurrences may damage the boiler. Any thoughts experts?
Thanks, Mandy

 

[Steady]

Apart from lagging pipes (which has been done), is there any other way to prevent this or will this be a yearly winter event?

Well- a couple of things-most reputable installers will increase the size of the condensate pipe to 32mm waste pipe for any pipe runs outside the property.
Alternatively ,if possible it is better to try and run the condensate pipe somewhere internally e.g. into an internal waste pipe.

Horizontal lengths of standard condensate pipe(21.5mm overflow pipe) run externally are always going to be at greatest risk of freezing .

 

[Hugh Jaleak]

I can see this being a more frequent event with the increasing numbers of condensing boilers being installed, some with badly thought out condensate drains. It might be part of the Governments master plan to reduce CO2 by preventing condensing boilers working when they're needed the most.....

I would think the best option is to keep external runs to a minimum, upsize pipework where possible, and thoroughly lag what has to be exposed to the elements. If someone could invent a heated pipe to carry the condensate then they could make some money this time of year.

 

[dextrous]

If someone could invent a heated pipe to carry the condensate then they could make some money this time of year.

You'd have thought that since it comes out of a big metal thing that produces a load of heat ayway, that it wouldn't be beyond someone's wit and ingenuity to incorporate some kind of gizmo.

Needless to say - it beats me

 

[Hugh Jaleak]

I was thinking along the lines of trace heating, but then would that be too warm for the plastic? The underground fittings for gas and water are now electrically fused to make the joint, maybe something along these lines? (But obviously not so it melts the pipe!) Power supply could be from a transformer located inside the boiler, coupled to a frost stat so only used when ambient temperature dictates.

 

[aprilseven]

Dragon's Den, here we come!!?
Our plumber had spent most of the day trying to fix the same problem at numerous boilers - at least someone was happy. Ching ching!
To be honest I would have paid any amount of money to have a warm house tonight.
Mandy

 

[Hugh Jaleak]

Going to have to get my thinking cap on!

I suspect virtually every boiler with a vunerable condensate drain has frozen over the last few days.... Problem being, when the temperature finally lifts, all will be ok again, and persuading people to invest in a heated pipe will become difficult during the warmer months.

 

[dextrous]

perhaps using a 2 channel condensate pipe, with some of the flue gases sent down one channel to keep it warm. Or something

 

[Hugh Jaleak]

I dont know if some kind of device similar to an automatic flush valve for a urinal would work? Rather than the slow trickle freezing over time to eventually block the pipe, if the condensate drained into a reservoir, then was discharged at full bore periodically it might not get chance to freeze.

 

[dextrous]

Or mixing the acidic condensate with salt should create heat as well as lower the freezing point of the solution. Where's Agile when you need him?

 

[RigidRaider]

I dont know if some kind of device similar to an automatic flush valve for a urinal would work? Rather than the slow trickle freezing over time to eventually block the pipe, if the condensate drained into a reservoir, then was discharged at full bore periodically it might not get chance to freeze.

Don't they all do that? Our new condensing boiler stores up the condensate then syphons it periodically down the plastic pipe just to avoid this very problem.

 

[Hugh Jaleak]

Im not 100% sure, about how the condensate drain functions, just seems to be a lot of folks getting cold because a frozen condensate drain has stopped the boiler working. Maybe the boilers are discharging little and often, then allowing water to remain in the pipe long enough to freeze.

Id have thought if this water was discharged with sufficient pressure and flow, it would pass through the pipe too quickly to prevent ice forming. Whilst I appreciate it is smaller pipework in most cases than a sink for example, i'd think even a 40mm waste would freeze up eventually if a constant trickle of water was running through it.

 

[joeb99]

get some T2 red trace heating cable, thread it into the condensation pipe oand out the end, terminate so the end cant get wet, then power it from the frost thremistat. It only heats to 65C, so wont melt the pipe and its cheep, £4 a meter.