Flue Position - House Party Wall does not match fence line

[onabudget]

I'd be grateful for some advice please,

Want to get a new condensing boiler fitted but have a specific question with regard to the flue position.

The house is an old 1920's soild brick wall - no cavity, the boiler would be mounted on the back kitchen wall. I've been told the flue must be 30cm from the boundary.

My garden is wider than my house, in that I've got a portion of what is behind my neighbours house.

There are no windows in this wall on my neighbours side on my side of the fence.

Hopefully I'm explaining this ok, it's where the middle line of the house where it's attached to my neighbour does not line up with the fence line in the back gardens, I have probably an additional two foot of room.

I've been told the flue sitting is all about nusiance and that as I have two feet of space before the fence line, this complies and my flue can come straight out in my garden as the steam will be on my property and won't go near the neighbours windows etc.

The other advice I have had is that it's the house wall boundary so it's still a no-no and i need a plume kit fitted.

Can anyone advise on this please

 

[Youllneverguess]

You'll probably be fine. What does your neighbour say?

 

[onabudget]

the neighbour is not worried as it had a very steamy flue before and that was position even closer than the condensing flue would be.

it was more of a case of the gas fitter being able to fit it within regs, and he is saying no, but other advice says it's looks ok and you have to use common sense where the boundary line does not match the fence. So looking to get a number of peoples views before I take the plunge.

thanks

 

[JohnD]

you can have an angled spout put on the end of the flue so that when the steam blows out (it is driven by a fan) it will tend to blow away from your neighbour

or at more expense you can have a flue extension that rises up like a chimney, to a height where the steam is not a nuisance, or goes horizontally inside or outside the house so the steam comes out in a more convenient position.

Modern condening boilers really do make a lot of steam on a cold day, especially when they are going flat out to run a bath or shower, so don't underestimate the nuisance.

I had my boiler positioned on a corner of the house so the steam blows past a side wall with no windows and is not a nuisance. Have a think about where else yours could go. Remember you want the condensate pipe going inside the house to a drainpipe, perhaps the one the sink goes to. If it is outside the house there is a very considerable risk of it freezing and blocking with ice, causing the boiler to stop working. This was the cause of a lot of grief last winter, when people who had a cheap and easy external pipe wished they hadn't. Don't say you weren't warned, as thousands of them did.

 

[onabudget]

yes planned to run the waste into the internal waste after the u bend, so that should be fine. I've looked at the pume kits, so are you saying that to comply with regs I need to plume it so it's 30cm from the centre of the party wall? thanks

 

[expertgasman]

I can't exactly get my head around your boundary issue, but there are two issues. One is nuisance, and that doesn't seem to be an issue.

The other is the mandatory minimum 600m to a boundary FACING the terminal and a mandatory minimum 300mm from a boundary at right angles to the terminal. The mandatory figures cannot be over ridden on a neighbours say so.

 

[onabudget]

I can't exactly get my head around your boundary issue, but there are two issues. One is nuisance, and that doesn't seem to be an issue.

The other is the mandatory minimum 600m to a boundary FACING the terminal and a mandatory minimum 300mm from a boundary at right angles to the terminal. The mandatory figures cannot be over ridden on a neighbours say so.

Sorry maybe I have not explained myself well enough, I'm not trying to get the neighbour to override anything, I only mentioned it as a comment asked what the neighbour thought.

The issue is what the word "boundary" means, from your response, I have no issue with the 600mm as the garden is ten meters long and the flue would point out the back wall of my kitchen into the garden, so that one is fine. Then your next point says 300mm from a boundary at right angles. If that means boundary to the fence between the houses then I am fine as there is 2 foot to spare from the flue to the fence.

But! if the boundary means 300mm to the party wall of the house then I am not fine as my fence is staggered across my neighbours back his house.

Does that help?

 

[Youllneverguess]

As an installer I would allow it as the boundary rule is partly there to deal with nuisance plumes, which you say does not affect the neighbour's windows, plus your staggered garden boundary.

 

[hansthebear]

baxi boiler with plume displacement kit (not management kit) will reduce horizontal boundary clearance to 25mm

 

[Youllneverguess]

But then you're stuck with a Baxi... What next? An Ideal

 

[expertgasman]

Sorry maybe I have not explained myself well enough, I'm not trying to get the neighbour to override anything, I only mentioned it as a comment asked what the neighbour thought.

I meant no offence, I was merely responding to the comment as well.

But! if the boundary means 300mm to the party wall of the house then I am not fine as my fence is staggered across my neighbours back his house.

If the boundary fence designates your neighbours land, then it is a no go. The 300mm / 600mm boundary rule is a building reg., and is there to prevent an appliance being fitted in such a position that, while currrently okay, would be wrong if the neighbour built a structure up to the boundary. Odd things then get thrown uo, such as Hans suggestion about reducing it to 25mm. I still don't think this would change the mandatory 300mm.

If, however, the fence didn't mark a legal boundary, then the 300mm clearance to a corner rule would kick in (if i correctly understand your layout), unless you went for hans' suggestion.

Could you post a sketch. (I'd be impressed if you could, as I wouldn't have a clue!)

Youllneverguess Posted: Tue Sep 06, 2011 4:21 pm Post Subject:

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As an installer I would allow it as the boundary rule is partly there to deal with nuisance plumes, which you say does not affect the neighbour's windows, plus your staggered garden boundary.

No it isn't.

 

[Youllneverguess]

PARTLY

It, I am sure, is also there to deal with the possible future constructions creating an internal corner; but the OP's garden boundary extends past the party wall.

The OP has 600mm of garden between the party wall and the fence boundary, so even if his current or future neighbour built an extension, there would be 600mm of garden and rear wall between that the and proposed flue terminal.

Unless I have misunderstood the layout.

 

[ServiceNumpty]

If the garden fence is the legal boundary of the garden as shown in the deeds, then I can't see an issue, as the plume is actually dispensing into your property and is 600mm from your neighbours garden boundary.

 

[expertgasman]

It, I am sure, is also there to deal with the possible future constructions creating an internal corner; but the OP's garden boundary extends past the party wall.

The BOUNDARY rulemis ENTIRELY about building in the future. It's effect does obviously coincide with minimum CLEARANCE rules. Pluming and it's offensive effects are different, and actually don't have specific measurements. If there is a danger of affecting the neighbour, then you are at risk of enforcement action.

I don't meant to be offensive or patronising, and some may think I'm pedantic. But the above is my understanding and take on it, and if you write the wrong thing down, (even if it changes nothing) on a report, it could come back and bite you.

The OP has 600mm of garden between the party wall and the fence boundary, so even if his current or future neighbour built an extension, there would be 600mm of garden and rear wall between that the and proposed flue terminal.

You may well be right! I just can't visualise what the OP means. But he did say that a fence is nearer than 300mm, so if that is attached to his wall then he has a problem with internal corner rule.

 

[Youllneverguess]

My understanding of boundary law - and this is of course assuming the garden fences have not moved gradually over the years - is that the boundary will follow a precise line along the garden boundary to the wall, then along that wall to the party wall.


I had a house where this exact situation occurred. We owned a wider section of land at the rear, and a narrower section at the front. in both cases the legal boundary was either the fence line or the wall; and luckily the painted colours of the house.

Which also happened to follow the party wall, which interlocked within the house front and back.

Was not sorry to leave that place for a detached I can assure you.