Freed doctor 'can quit Australia'

[lvsystems]

Well said stulz and softus another balanced and well agrued case. IMO is it is because of liberals such as ellal that we are being blocked in our efforts to overcome a very real threat posed by citizens of our own country intent on bringing bloodshed and horror to our shores. As people have said in the past we are at war and in war time tough decisions have to be made and if people have to be detained without charge or have visas revoked for the common good then so be it.

Incidentally are you aware one of the 21/7 bomber was allowed to fly to pakistan a known terrorist hot spot with a substantial amount of cash and re enter the country with no checks despite being on a govnt watch list. It is precisely because of things like this that the laws need to be tougher and enforced more rigorously.

As for the forest gate I cannot simply believe that the security forces and policce carried out a raid of that magnitude with absolutely no evidence of their involvement or dubious links. Remember just because the media doesn't report it doesn't mean they didn't pose a significant threat

 

[Stulz]

Well the Dr is now back home in India squarking about his treatment. Some of his comments do not ring true and he is talking like someone with something to hide and a political agenda.

Ellal, you may have forgotten from my earlier posts, but I am a Muslim, I see this with an Islamic background, and the Doctor is not what he may appear to the world.

These people bring shame on Islam, their families and humanity in general, they taint it with an odour that is not so easily removed. All right minded and decent people, regardless of religion and politics have a duty to protect the innocent and do whatever is necessary, regardless of how unpleasant it may seem at the time, to realise that defence.

Those who do not feel this way give comfort to the terrorists and make it easier for them to attack our ideals, our way of life and our children.

 

[tim west]

we are being blocked in our efforts to overcome a very real threat posed by citizens of our own country intent on bringing bloodshed and horror to our shores.

Is that because they have members of their families over there being killed? It isn't just happening over here we are not the focus for all that goes on in the world.
People don't just get up one day and decide to kill others, there has to be a cause, our forces invading these countries and killing their men, women and children isn't the answer merely fuelling the fire, so when we reap the rewards of this in attacks over here should we be so surprised?
Tit for tat isn't the answer, One side has to give in, maybe a well publicised evacuation of british troops along with an announced aid package for the victims may help somewhat towards the terrible damage caused by western interference there.
The troops went in to do a job in ousting Saddam and finding the "weapons of mass destruction", the jobs done with Saddam the so called "WMD" wern't there , they should now come home.

 

[ellal]

Ellal, do you always believe the Press and a money oriented Lawyer?

Nope...

Just what I read from the Australian government itself!

The fact is that Dr Hanif has 9 months left on his Visa, and he (Andrews)does not have the authority under Australian law to revoke the visa UNLESS he can show to a Judge that he poses a significant threat or has been convicted of an offence in court.

B*llocks!...don't make yourself look any more stupid than you already have!

Further Ellal, this is a matter for Australia, so why are you bleeting about it here?

Apart from the fact that you think it equally important to comment on, where do you think the info about the Sim card came from?..

This is a prime example of how the liberalisation of the law leaves people vulnerable when the rights of the accused or the guilty are deemed more important than the rights of potential or actual victims

Taking the p*ss again...but then I guess you would take the imposition of the various anti-terror laws around the western world as 'liberalisation' when most sane people would see them as unnecessary and draconian..

Ellal, you may have forgotten from my earlier posts, but I am a Muslim, I see this with an Islamic background, and the Doctor is not what he may appear to the world....

Well the Dr is now back home in India squarking about his treatment. Some of his comments do not ring true and he is talking like someone with something to hide and a political agenda.....

Ah - the all knowing 'muslim' ( )...ROTFL!

Anyway, all you 'doppelgangers' posting on this can continue with your ill-informed prejudiced cr*p...whatever!

 

[Stulz]

Ella, I have not insulted you, so please do not insult me. I am one person, so please leave your childish comments about multiple posts to other discussions.

If you so wish I am quite sure we could get the moderators to check IP's as logged by the system and state who is or is not the Multiple posters. I have no idea whether you are or whether others are, I care not, if people are so sad as to post under multiple identities then their opinion counts for nought.

 

[Softus]

I care not...
.
.
.
...if people are so sad as to post under multiple identities then their opinion counts for nought.

I don't quite see how you can believe both of those things at the same time.

 

[lvsystems]

we are being blocked in our efforts to overcome a very real threat posed by citizens of our own country intent on bringing bloodshed and horror to our shores.

Is that because they have members of their families over there being killed? It isn't just happening over here we are not the focus for all that goes on in the world.
People don't just get up one day and decide to kill others, there has to be a cause, our forces invading these countries and killing their men, women and children isn't the answer merely fuelling the fire, so when we reap the rewards of this in attacks over here should we be so surprised?
Tit for tat isn't the answer, One side has to give in, maybe a well publicised evacuation of british troops along with an announced aid package for the victims may help somewhat towards the terrible damage caused by western interference there.
The troops went in to do a job in ousting Saddam and finding the "weapons of mass destruction", the jobs done with Saddam the so called "WMD" wern't there , they should now come home.

That's all very well and I agree tit for tat is not the answer. However as said before we are at war and measures have to be taken to protect our homeland security. As for just withdrawing from Iraq that simply is not possible. If a total withdrawal was ordered tomorrow the region would go into meltdown shortly followed by the rest of the Middle East. One of my best friends has seen two tours of service in Iraq and has first hand experience of the problems they face. As for killing there women and children I think you'll find it's mainly the insurgents doing that not us.

As for aid packages how much more f***ing money can this country throw at foreign causes. I'd like to see a downgrading of British troops and more help from our European (so called neighbours). With the global climnate the way it is we cannot shy away from challenge and back down to terrorists and dictator ships like Iran and formerly Iraq. If we did then the situation would become a whole lot worse imagine Iran Russia and North Korea knowing that we will not stand up to dictators. Then imagine Bush with his fingering hovering over the big red button. Does not bear thinking about

 

[tim west]

As for killing there women and children I think you'll find it's mainly the insurgents doing that not us.

The insurgents don't have access to cruise missiles.

 

[ellal]

ellal, I have not insulted you, so please do not insult me.

I guess then 'bleet like a sheep' is not an insult in your world?...(and prompted by 'someone' else perchance?)

You also stuck by claims that are patently untrue even when shown otherwise...

so think again about what constitutes an insult!

 

[lvsystems]

That the best you can come up with ?
No but they do have access (thanks to iran) to surface to air missiles, RPG's , roadside bombs (indiscriminately killing not only our soldiers but they're own civilians). Not to mention the various d***heads who blow themselves up in crowded places. We follow very strict guidelines when we go into war. They just indiscriminately harm. maim and kill people.

 

[tim west]

That the best you can come up with ?
No but they do have access (thanks to iran) to surface to air missiles, RPG's , roadside bombs (indiscriminately killing not only our soldiers but they're own civilians). Not to mention the various d***heads who blow themselves up in crowded places. We follow very strict guidelines when we go into war. They just indiscriminately harm. maim and kill people.

Don't get what you mean by "That the best you can come up with" is this some form of competiton rather than a discussion then??
You keep mentioning the word "we" is that the british or the western alliance?
The Americans have shown in the past how indiscriminately they use their firepower, even killing a few british soldiers along the way.

 

[lvsystems]

No it's not a competition I just thought in a serious debate like this you would acknowledge that some of my points do bear merit. As for we my primary concern is the british Armed forces. The americans have a part to play too of course and I can't argue your point regards friendly fire issues. However, whether we like it or not we are firmly involved and my point is that we cannot just withdraw to the sidelines and let the region go into meltdown. Otherwise, things will only get a whole lot worse

 

[tim west]

No it's not a competition I just thought in a serious debate like this you would acknowledge that some of my points do bear merit. As for we my primary concern is the british Armed forces. The americans have a part to play too of course and I can't argue your point regards friendly fire issues. However, whether we like it or not we are firmly involved and my point is that we cannot just withdraw to the sidelines and let the region go into meltdown. Otherwise, things will only get a whole lot worse

Sorry for the misunderstanding then, some points you make are valid such as total evacuation may further destabilise an already unstable situation but I was talking about a British withdrawal to alleviate our predicament. And I'm not denying the wrongdoings happening here just asking the reasons why it's happening.

 

[lvsystems]

Not a problem this is an issue where there are many different issues and angles on those so it can get heated. I'd love a partial evacuation of British troops but until we get the assistance we so dearly need form the other EU members we cannot. Tim if I could answer that question my views would be totally wasted on a DIY forum

 

[tim west]

Which brings us around in a circle back to having a liberal or middle of the road view, I believe it's best to approach any argument from both sides and try to understand both sides disagreements that way a plan of action for peace can be started whereas the blind show of force merely aggravates the situation alienating any allies you may have had over there, even the alliances own installed puppet of a leader has complained about the uneven retaliation shown by the west. If we can make enemies that easily, how easily can we make friends?
War isn't a new thing and lots have been stopped by negotiation.
Let us as british people admit there are things that are wrong in what we are doing over there and show a new leaf by washing our hands of Bush's war.