HMRC warning..

[EFLImpudence]

Sorry it's a bit late but my pc packed up on Sunday.

If you turn yourselves into mobile phone companies making billions in profits you won't have to pay tax.

Or a local government worker/ public sector worker who tries to undermine the economy by going on strike so people cannot get to work to pay their taxes.

No one takes strike action for fun - they do not get paid.
It is more likely brought about by typically bad british management or deliberate provocation.

Or union leaders recommending strike action during the olympics to further their cause and cause misery to others.

I am not sure of the reason for that, so I will not comment.

I bet if bankers, lawyers, estate agents or removal men went on strike, the public sector worker who had planned to move house on that day, would be in tears and distress.

In the case of removal men, I suspect support would be the more likely.

As for the other groups - yeah! right.

socialism, communism is a failed idea, it brings down industry, economies, living standards and countries.

There has never been a true socialist or communist regime.

For Centuries, China's method of government has ensured poverty and misery for 95% of its people, now they have embrassed the free market, it is booming beyond belief, and their tax revenue is manifoldly increased. Their biggest industries have untold wealth and also employ millions upon millions of people.

Perhaps, then, we may have been better off had we not exported jobs on the pretext of greater efficiency.

There is nothing wrong in being a multi millionaire.

It depends how the multi-millions have been made.

Extremely good companies producing what the customer wants or slavery.

Imagine all the mobile phone companies out there employing thousands of people who pay their taxes, who dont go on strike and disrupt the economy.

Perhaps good management, as above or - just a minute, are they all made in China?

On that point, when we hear about millions of bonuses being paid to bankers. That stat is wrong.

What stat?

most of the millions go to ordinary workers meeting their own individual targets. Like getting a bonus for customer satisfaction, few mistakes, passing exams and progressing and even attendance.

So, do I get a bonus for doing my job properly?

No one is complaining about your friendly teller receiving a small bonus.
However, the bosses receiving huge bonuses for leading the company to losing billions is a farce.

I wont mention the attendance levels in the public sector.

Ok, fair enough but we're back to bad management.

Mine and your tax pay for symathetic doctors giving sick notes for anxiety, depression and other long term illneses or public sector workers not turning up for work because they are a "bit ill". (not withstanding genuine cases)

I don't know the answer to that one - health and safety gone mad?

We need to stand up and react to this nonsense. Those who withhold their labour on the grounds of purely looking after themselves is selfish, self centred, not forward looking, damaging and another reason why this country, under any sort of labour, socialist government will not be anywhere near full employment.

We don't have a labour government. The present crisis was caused by the world banking system but we, for some reason, have to pay for it.

To the OP. What have we got to worry about if we declare what we earn.

He probably has nothing to fear.

He, more likely is incensed by the injustice whereby the more you earn, the more you can get away with and the fabulously wealthy can do what they want.

Have you ever wondered who invented tax havens and for what purpose and why there are such within the British Isles?

 

[BeeLZeebub]

A glib comment

? Er, yeah ... A comment you've clearly reeled off before despite failing to understand the issue

 

[JohnD]

It's nice to know that the banking sector has its loyal supporters.

I'm not convinced that the activities of Mr Fred Goodwin created wealth.

Obviously Traders don't create wealth, they just move it around.

 

[ban-all-sheds]

They can "create" it for themselves by taking it from other people by making something which has zero or negative value and selling it for a positive amount.

 

[BeeLZeebub]

You're persistent with this "traders / banks move wealth around" thing. That's the whole point: the core activity of banks is to facilitate the creation of wealth by lending for investment. As part of the process, they extract a margin (call it wealth creation if you want) just like any other industry. What point is it you're trying to make?

Loyalty? No, I just cant stand politically-motivated hate campaigns. If you truly believe that the global crisis was simply down to "the banks" then the Labour government did their job well.

 

[JohnW2]

Obviously Traders don't create wealth, they just move it around.

I'm not sure what you mean by 'create'. Except in the rather different situation when money gets printed, all that happens with money is that it 'moves around'. A trader, banker, company, country or even electrician becomes wealthy if the net movement of money in their direction is large and positive - no matter who 'moves' it, or how.

Kind Regards, John.

 

[BeeLZeebub]

They can "create" it for themselves by taking it from other people by making something which has zero or negative value and selling it for a positive amount.

That's close to the verbal equivalent of Escher's staircase, but I think you could be describing the process of just, well, selling stuff, no?

 

[JohnD]

has BeeLZeebub explained yet how banks "create" wealth?

 

[BeeLZeebub]

has BeeLZeebub explained yet how banks "create" wealth?

Well, I did provide a precis of the process above (and I'm sure you noted my presumption that, irrespective of how you define wealth, it must be applied evenly) ... but if you insist on more, then try this: ask yourself 'how does an electrician create wealth?', and then try and adapt it to other industries and professions. It really shouldn't prove to be too enlightening ...

 

[scousespark]

Two men are in a bank and the first draws out £100. The second says, I can double that. The first hands over the money and and the second takes it to a casino and loses it. The first guy has lost out.

At the same time, the bank takes £45,000,000,000 and loses it in a bigger casino. Luckily, they are a business, so they go to the government, who lends them the money (meaning everybody in the country lends to the bank). Then comes bonus time. The bank is still operating, so the gamblers get a massive bonus. The rest of the staff get their bonus too.

This year their bonus is lower, even though the bank doubles it's loss.

I'm sure BeelZeebub can explain why this is okay

The wealth creation bit comes from investing in industry. There is precious litle of this.

 

[JohnW2]

has BeeLZeebub explained yet how banks "create" wealth?

...or, as I said in response to your comment about traders, how anyone, or any company, organisation, country or whatever can 'create' wealth, rather than simply 'move money around', more in some directions than others.

Kind Regards, John.

 

[BeeLZeebub]

At the same time, the bank takes £45,000,000,000 and loses it in a bigger casino. Luckily, they are a business, so they go to the government, who lends them the money (meaning everybody in the country lends to the bank). Then comes bonus time. The bank is still operating, so the gamblers get a massive bonus. The rest of the staff get their bonus too.

This year their bonus is lower, even though the bank doubles it's loss.

I'm sure BeelZeebub can explain why this is okay

The wealth creation bit comes from investing in industry. There is precious litle of this.

Your blaming banks for being forced to make use of lax regulations to do anything in their power to compete in a break neck industry? If there were no regs in the electrical industry, what do you think would happen? Casinos? I take it this non-commercial, moral stance prompted you to halt payments into your pension prior to 2008 and to sell your house given your indigination at its inflated price? Or is it a retrospective 'thing'? And why would I defend bonuses for failure? You see what you're doing? You're assuming that this is industry practise arent you? Should I assume you're a dodgy spark because some idiot wired my house badly?

 

[JohnW2]

The wealth creation bit comes from investing in industry. There is precious litle of this.

That doesn't 'create wealth'. It merely moves wealth from the customers of that industry to the industry's companies, directors employees and investors.

Kind Regards, John.

 

[BeeLZeebub]

The wealth creation bit comes from investing in industry. There is precious litle of this.

That doesn't 'create wealth'. It merely moves wealth from the customers of that industry to the industry's companies, directors employees and investors.

Kind Regards, John.

Not really John .... there would be no transfer of wealth from customers/savers who are divorced from a savings/lending process which would generate wealth in the event of positive returns on the investment.

After years of being subjected to accusations of wreckless lending, the government would now have the sector dole out loans to companies irrespective of their financial viability !!

 

[JohnW2]

Not really John .... there would be no transfer of wealth from customers/savers who are divorced from a savings/lending process which would generate wealth in the event of positive returns on the investment.

I don't pretend to understand exactly what that's meant to mean, but you can't get away from the fact that, except for someone who 'prints money', if the wealth of one person (or company, or country or whatever) increases then there has to be a corresponding decrease in wealth of one or more other people (or companies, countries etc.). At any point in time, there is a finite and defined amount of 'wealth' (money or assets) in the world, and all one can change is how it's distributed.

Kind Regards, John.