How to use a pop rivet with restricted access

[andrew700andrew]

Hi, i'm going to need to attach two aluminium box sections together and I want to secure them mechanically with pop rivets. However, the problem is that becuase the box section is basically a tube, it will be difficult to use the rivet gun to put a rivet in the lower surface of the tube. Please see the attatched image for an explanation. As you can see, there is no way to get the rivet gun close enough to the rivet head to squeeze it. Does anyone know of a type of rivet or something similar which I could to do get around this problem?

Thanks!

Untitled

• andrew700andrew
• 23 Feb 2015
• 1

 

[AlanE]

How big is the 'drilled hole'?

 

[Burnerman]

I guess you are delving into specialist territory here, but Machine Mart has air rivetters which have a much longer nose than the standard hand tool?
CAT3 and the CPR2 spring to mind.
Presumably extended mandrel rivets are available somewhere, and those plus a fabricated spacer could work.
John

 

[freddiemercurystwin]

As above, how big/deep is the hole? A lazy tong rivet tool is the immediate suggestion depending on access.

 

[Dave54]

Even the ordinary Clarke hand riveter has a longer "nose" than the cheaper type. I nearly bought one the other day. I doubt if the other options are any smaller diameter.
You might get away with that, and a turned spacer as John suggests if the rivet stem is long enough.
The only other way I can think of would be to use traditional rivets (used to be able to get them in alloy, but I haven't looked) and a pair of made up "dollies" one to fit down the bottom tube to be held in a vice, with the dimple on the side, and another small enough to go through the hole.
Really though, and without wanting to sound smart, you're better off designing from techniques that you know will work if possible, rather than looking to invent a technique.
Can the alloy be welded for example to do away with the fixing there?

 

[Burnerman]

There could be a vote for self tapping screws and adhesive here....
John

 

[foxhole]

self tapper, easy access for driver.

 

[andrew700andrew]

The absolute maximum diameter of the access hole would be 12mm, since the actual box section is 15x15mm wide with a wall of about 1mm. the problem is that it's aluminium and so not easy to solder or weld with the facilities available to me, and I want to use a mechanical rather than adhesive bond becuase it needs to be removable incase the parts are dammaged and need to be replaced.

 

[Dave54]

Small machine screw and nyloc nut?

 

[andrew700andrew]

I guess you are delving into specialist territory here, but Machine Mart has air rivetters which have a much longer nose than the standard hand tool?
CAT3 and the CPR2 spring to mind.
Presumably extended mandrel rivets are available somewhere, and those plus a fabricated spacer could work.
John

I've just understood what you meant by using a "fabricated spacer", do you mean put one of them between the rivet head and the rivet gun and use it like a temporary extension to the gun, which can be removed afterwards? I'll try this tomorrow and see if it works. Thanks.

 

[andrew700andrew]

Small machine screw and nyloc nut?

I was considering this but I just preferred the idea of rivets, since they will be also used elsewhere and this will be a high vibration use which may get some flexing, so even a nylon locking nut might not be up to it. I'm not completely agains this, I was just hoping there would be something a bit more elegant. But thanks anyway.

 

[Burnerman]

Can you provide an access hole on the lower section?
If you can, Dave's idea using screws and locking nuts is the way to go and it wouldn't matter how long the box sections are.
I wouldn't be too happy with 1mm section and self tappers......not too much purchase there.
John

 

[Burnerman]

I guess you are delving into specialist territory here, but Machine Mart has air rivetters which have a much longer nose than the standard hand tool?
CAT3 and the CPR2 spring to mind.
Presumably extended mandrel rivets are available somewhere, and those plus a fabricated spacer could work.
John

I've just understood what you meant by using a "fabricated spacer", do you mean put one of them between the rivet head and the rivet gun and use it like a temporary extension to the gun, which can be removed afterwards? I'll try this tomorrow and see if it works. Thanks.

Wow, much interest here!
That's what I do mean, if you can get extended mandrel rivets. However, I don't know if the rivet mandrel would snap off flush - only an experiment would prove that.
John

 

[andrew700andrew]

I guess you are delving into specialist territory here, but Machine Mart has air rivetters which have a much longer nose than the standard hand tool?
CAT3 and the CPR2 spring to mind.
Presumably extended mandrel rivets are available somewhere, and those plus a fabricated spacer could work.
John

I've just understood what you meant by using a "fabricated spacer", do you mean put one of them between the rivet head and the rivet gun and use it like a temporary extension to the gun, which can be removed afterwards? I'll try this tomorrow and see if it works. Thanks.

Wow, much interest here!
That's what I do mean, if you can get extended mandrel rivets. However, I don't know if the rivet mandrel would snap off flush - only an experiment would prove that.
John

Yep, I'll test it tomorrow, or Wednesday at the latest and come back with my results (Really hoping it will work ). Otherwise it will have to be a machine screw and nylon lock nut, and I am able to make the same sized hole in the bottom box section too.

 

[Burnerman]

A drop of Loctite thread lock will take care of any vibration issues mate.
What are you up to now?
John