Is this newell post safe?

[king2001]

Hello all,

Just started to overhaul our stairs and upon removing part of the wooden cladding I discovered that the newell post has some deep saw cuts in it and so am a bit concerned as to its safety!

As you can see in the last image above there is a wooden frame that runs up the post but that seems to be just for the cladding. There is also a cut on the back of the post which is above the one on the front.

Is this safe as from what i can gather the post is supporting the stairs (see image below) or can I assume that this needs to be replaced?. The original plan was to cut the newell post off at ceiling height and open up the space underneath but if it is supporting the stairs then that won't be the best idea I've had!

Hope you can help me out on this!

 

[king2001]

Anyone have any thoughts on this?

 

[noseall]

mmmm...........bit tricky this one.

i'm wondering if previous owners may have tried to remove it and realized that the stairs are reliant upon said newell, when everything started to wobble a little!

does everything seem solid? does the newell waggle at the top?

newels can be jointed succesfully provided they're done correctly.

according to the photo, you have some studwork joined to the post, which will in effect, stiffen the post. do you intend removing this timberwork?

in percentage, how deep is the saw cut?

 

[noseall]

just read the whole of the post!! via a nice glass of red wine.

you will not be able to remove this newel unless you build up block work, stud work or similar underneath. the exposed edge of the stairs is reliant upon it.

is the stair stringer mortice and tenoned into the newel?

 

[king2001]

hi noseall and thanks for the reply.

There is some slight movement in the newell post but nothing that has concerned me - well not until I saw the cuts in the post!

The studwork on the side was used for pinning the tongue and groove panelling but as you point out it will be strengthening the post as well.

I'd say the deepest cut is the one in the front and that is about 40% through whereas the one at the back is only about 25% but is a good 7-8 inches above the front one.

I believe the stringer is morticed into the post and that is shown in the last picture in my original post.

One thing we noticed is when standing in the hall and looking at the stairs is that the newel post is dead straight until the cuts where it then starts to lean slightly towards the stairs.

The joys of bodged DIY!

 

[noseall]

the upshot of this story is, yes, the newel can be removed so long as you put either, something similar back or build a wall beneath.

 

[big-all]

ok my suggestion assuming the woodwork behind is giving it some support [if not screw a batton on screws less than half depth ]

mark a foot above angled up at about 30% and below angled down below the back cut mark half depth of post remove this front area splice in new wood glue and clamp
screw and plug from the back once the woodwork has been removed

 

[king2001]

Thank you all for your replies!

To be honest I think I would consider replacing the whole post rather than just a section as it will be glossed along with the rest of the stairs and it might look a bit rough if I attempt it.

I am going to have a look at my next door neighbours setup tonight as I am 99.9% sure their newell post was cut off near the ceiling and I'm not sure what work was carried out to do this.

If anyone has other suggestions then I'm all ears!

 

[Shoutingman]

Having seen this it has me worried a little regarding my project. As I stated in my earlier topic I am replacing my stairs. By the look of Kings photo's his top Newell goes from the upper level right down to the ground floor. Should I have one like this or is there another way of securing the stairs to the upper floor, a joist hanger for example?

 

[noseall]

some stairs will have a trimmer beam running all the way through, upon which the entire width of the stairs can rest. this isn't always the case as some houses don't have the room for the going of the stairs and a trimmer.

 

[king2001]

I believe my stairs are like this because we have a small sublanding which is set below the main joists. It would be much easier if that wasn't there and the stairs could be attached to a trimmer instead.

 

[noseall]

it's because of the sub landing that you have a full length newel.

in order for you to trim this type of stairs layout the trimmer would have to be below the ceiling line, which in turn would mean a lump of wood across the hall ceiling.

 

[Thermo]

why not strengthen it with some metal plates. you can chisel an area out either side of the cuts, put the plates across and screw them in place. You can then cover them with small pieces of timber and fill prior to repainting.