Kitchen electrics alterations

[SolRobinson]

Hi, so I wanted to just get the opinion of some of you on here on my plans to alter the electrics in my kitchen. Some background on myself, I am an avid DIYer and will try anything once. I've had basic experience with electrical work and would deem myself competent in altering existing circuits.

My property is from the 1970s but before I purchased it, it seems to have had an entire rewire & new CU within the last 10 years. All the sockets downstairs (bar 1 which is on a 16amp MCB for the burglar alarm) are on 1 32amp MCB with RCD protection. We have changed the layout of our kitchen & dining room, we had a wall removed that split the two and we plan to move the kitchen into the dining room and dining room into the old kitchen. In the (current) dining room there are no sockets at all. In the old kitchen there are 2 double sockets & 1 cooker socket/switch (which is on it's own breaker with 4mm T+E).

The start of the ring main is the first socket in the old kitchen, I plan to move this socket as it is currently at kitchen worktop height and have it as a "new" dining room socket. I then want to extend this to another socket in the dining room area, before then extending into the kitchen and adding 4/5 new sockets in where the new kitchen will be, with switched fused spurs from a few of the sockets for appliances.
I also then plan to extend the cooker feed using Wago 222 & Wago junction box for maintenance free, as this will be ran under the subfloor, into the new kitchen so that the cooker is still on it's own breaker.

Does anyone see any problems with these alterations and am I right in saying that none of this is notifiable. And although probably recommended I won't need an EIC for any of this work, correct?

 

[markyd1]

Type A Rcd needed, Minor works cert needed and how are you going to test all this before carrying out the work and then on completion

 

[markyd1]

I am an avid DIYer and will try anything once

ONCE is the only chance you might get

 

[SolRobinson]

Type A Rcd needed, Minor works cert needed and how are you going to test all this before carrying out the work and then on completion

It is already Type A. I have access to a multifunction tester to perform tests before and after. But the minor works cert is a good shout.

ONCE is the only chance you might get

As I said, I’ve done basic electrical work before and understand testing. Don’t need the scaremongering I just needed opinions as I’ve never done anything of this scale before.

 

[JohnW2]

Type A Rcd needed, Minor works cert needed and how are you going to test all this before carrying out the work and then on completion

ONCE is the only chance you might get

Do you you disapprove of or, at least, try to discourage, all DIY electrical work?

As a matter of interest, would you like to hazard a guess at to what proportion of the (countless millions of) RCDs currently in-service in the UK are Type A?

 

[flameport]

Does anyone see any problems with these alterations and am I right in saying that none of this is notifiable.

If you are in England, the electrical work is not notifiable. If in Wales it is.

we plan to move the kitchen into the dining room

That is notifiable.

 

[JohnW2]

...we plan to move the kitchen into the dining room and dining room

That is notifiable.

The electrical work involved in the 'move' (which could well only involve 'modifying' or extending the existing circuits) ??

Kind Regards, John

 

[Murdochcat]

As a matter of interest, would you like to hazard a guess at to what proportion of the (countless millions of) RCDs currently in-service in the UK are Type A?

2% would be my guess and I suspect there are about 20% of homes without RCD's

So that makes about 78% of homes with type AC RCD's

Which is why manufacturers and dodgy sparks make out that 98% of homes need new RCD's.

Which is why I simply won't go along with this money making scheme for manufacturers

 

[SolRobinson]

If you are in England, the electrical work is not notifiable. If in Wales it is.


That is notifiable.

The electrical work involved in the 'move' (which could well only involve 'modifying' or extending the existing circuits) ??

Kind Regards, John

Yeah I'm not exactly sure how this would be notifiable? I am only modifying the circuit, which is allowed under part P, there are no new circuits. Which I believe is what you're saying John? Can you explain more @flameport ? I am in England fyi.

 

[JohnW2]

2% would be my guess and I suspect there are about 20% of homes without RCD's .... So that makes about 78% of homes with type AC RCD's

Exactly my point - and, as you go on to say, more dramatically, about 98% of the RCDs in domestic service are quite probably Type AC.

Which is why manufacturers and dodgy sparks make out that 98% of homes need new RCD's. Which is why I simply won't go along with this money making scheme for manufacturers

Quite so. As I often say, if one looks dispassionately at the big picture, it's fairly questionable (at least, in my mind) as the whether the amount ('billions') that has been spent on the purchase and installation of any RCDs has been 'cost-effective' (in comparison with spending the money/effort on something else, such as road safety or medical treatment/research) - so to suggest that virtually all of them now 'need to be replaced' merely increases that 'questionable'.

Furthermore, as I have been saying for a long time, despite having tried very hard, I have yet to find much 'chapter and verse' that helps me understand/quantify the actual degree of 'risk' that may result from the use of Type AC RCDs.

Kind Regards, John

 

[JohnW2]

Yeah I'm not exactly sure how this would be notifiable? I am only modifying the circuit, which is allowed under part P, there are no new circuits. Which I believe is what you're saying John? Can you explain more @flameport ? I am in England fyi.

Exactly. I suspect that flameport was referring to parts of the Building Regs other than Part P (electrical). Under Part H (plumbing/drainage) installation of a 'new bathroom' (which I imagine would include moving it from one room to another) IS notifiable - in terms of the plumbing/drainage, not the electrics (if any).

Kind Regards, John

 

[ericmark]

Change of use of a room into a kitchen, bathroom, etc is notifiable, it has nothing to do with Part P. I got caught out, I employed a builder who I thought was doing it all, including notifying, so when he ran off, I told the LABC I was taking over the job, seems he had not told the LABC who told us in no uncertain terms it is the owners responsibility to ensure the notifying is done.

The problem is once the LABC inspector gets involved what seems simple can get far more complex, he insisted with fitted extractor fans even with opening windows, I did wish we had never told them.

However I did get him to allow me to do my own electrics.

 

[jjimjam]

Change of use of a room into a kitchen, bathroom, etc is notifiable,

Oh, that's awkward - are you sure?

In a phone call to my local building control they said I just needed to notify the individual jobs. I've done it all now!

 

[ericmark]

Building control can decide what they want, if they say you can do it, you can.

 

[Murdochcat]

Exactly my point - and, as you go on to say, more dramatically, about 98% of the RCDs in domestic service are quite probably Type AC.

Furthermore, as I have been saying for a long time, despite having tried very hard, I have yet to find much 'chapter and verse' that helps me understand/quantify the actual degree of 'risk' that may result from the use of Type AC RCDs.

Kind Regards, John

I find the so called sparks saying they have to replace RCDs or even entire fuseboards before they will make very minor changes, rather tiresome.

the only organisations gaining from the too frequently changing regs are principally the manufacturers selling equipment , followed by the training companies, the IET book sales and the CPS’s

i too have found it difficult to secure absolute clarity on the matter and from I see in the field most people just see a RCD and crack on …….

i suspect it’s been left very ambiguous so that nobody can be criticised