Leaking uPVC window

[noelrobx]

There is a river of water getting into the flat underneath me after every time it rains hard...like all of Dec, Jan and Feb! I notice that there is a small gap between the bottom of the window and the frame, with larger gaps at the ends. I was told that there should be an escape gap for water under the frame where it sits on the sill but there is no gap at all. So, all this torrential rain runs down these large windows (over 2m high) and gets into the frame but cannot escape. It then finds its way very easily into the flat below and has ruined the ceiling and flooring there. What is the gap for? How can I block the gap? This is a large sliding patio door and it will be a nightmare to take out to investigate. The gap has a brush along it now filled with moss. Thanks for any feedback you can give.

Noel

 

[Gazman16]

Pics please

 

[noelrobx]

Here's a pic, hopefully! The gap along the side with the screws showing has a deep hole at the bottom, about 4cms. I can fill this hole with sealant and put trim along the vertical gap. But it is the small gap along the bottom of the window and the frame, marked by the line of brush hairs covered in moss in the pic, that I am most concerned about. Why is that gap there? Fine indoors, but a nightmare outside.

Any thoughts?

Noel

 

[Gazman16]

I think the frame may have been fitted the wrong way around. Hopefully some of the other guys will be along to confirm in a bit.

Im fairly sure the opener and the track for the opener should always be fitted to the outside.

 

[DHFrames]

Looks like the door isn't sat correctly on the sill, the frame of the door needs to be moved forward approx 60-80mm (or the sill needs to be moved back).
I would say the water getting into the frame is draining out and missing the back edge of the sill, penetrating down below. The flashing on the right doesn't look convincing either
There should be a cap to cover the side where the screw is.
Gaz, don't think it's round the wrong way our Rehau patios have the sliders on the inside.
Did a builder fit this

 

[Gazman16]

Good spot on the cill.

Either way its going to need taking out and refitting correctly

 

[noelrobx]

Thanks all of you, Going to bed now as I have my daughter staying this weekend but I'll get back to you tomorrow. I can't see my photo on this website but you all seem to be able to see it. Howzat? You are all so much more knowledgeable than me and are using techie terms so I will try to understand. The stuff on the right of the photo was a covering my mate did to cover the gap the fitters left at the end. It looks terrible doesn't it? I had to cover the gap there so what could I do? I'll try to have a good answer to your points tomorrow.

Thanks everyone for your comments. What do I do to see the photo I posted?

Noel

 

[DHFrames]

Go into your profile, under Noel's Windows.
How long ago was the door fitted? Get them back

 

[noelrobx]

Thanks everyone for staying with me on this. The door was fitted over 10 years ago. The fitters (OPW Walthamstow) put the opening door the wrong way round; it should have opened from right to left looking out onto the balcony from the room but it opens left to right. I was really annoyed about this but as the fitters had been called back to replace a previous door they had fitted badly (tilt and turn?) I was just glad I had a functioning door system. Of course I didn't know at the time that it was leaking water into the flat below when it rained hard with a wind from the west (all the last 3 months!) Another point: isn't any water that gets into the frame supposed to drain outside onto the sill? One PVC fitter told me there should be a gap between the sill and the frame for water to escape. Does that sound right to you lot? He told me to run a blade along the gap to remove any blocking debris: but, no gap! All thoughts really appreciated. Cheers, Noel

 

[DHFrames]

So it seems the door has been fitted the correct way round but unfortunately they put the opener on the wrong side!!?? This means the drainage holes are where they should be, if you open the door you should be able to see the drainage slots in the bottom channel, pour some water into that channel, the water should then come out onto the sill outside. If it doesn't the water is missing the sill and running down through into below.
As mentioned the sill needs to be fitted further back to catch the water.

Is underneath the sill sealed?? Water can be penetrating in this way also!

 

[noelrobx]

Well, I'm not sure the frame is fitted correctly... how can I tell? What does 'put the opener on the wrong side' mean? Do you mean the side of the door that opens? I haven't seen any drainage slots. I will have another look. No water can come through onto the sill outside because there's no gap for it to do so. I can't understand how the sill can be fitted further back... back into the room? And how can I find out if underneath the sill is sealed? All very confusing...

Noel

 

[DHFrames]

I'll explain more in detail later

 

[DHFrames]

This is approx where the drainage hole will be, a slot like this

Untitled

• DHFrames
• 23 Feb 2014
• 1

This is how the frame should be sat on the sill (it is not)

Untitled

• DHFrames
• 23 Feb 2014
• 1

This is where the water should drain out on to the sill, bad sketch I know!

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• DHFrames
• 23 Feb 2014
• 1

This is how I think your frame is sat on the sill and how I think the water is draining

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• DHFrames
• 23 Feb 2014
• 1

can you now see the sill needs to go back so the whole of the frame is sitting on the sill??

The reason there's no gap along the sill is because is due to the sill being tight up against the frame.

The frame is fitted correctly in terms of its the right way round, the outside of the frame is on the outside, We weren't sure whether the frame was fitted the right way to start but now you say it's a tilt n turn the opening door can only go on one side (the inside), the fact that they've put the door on the wrong side is a mistake and doesn't affect the the way the door works, especially the drainage.
If underneath the sill isn't sealed or water tight that water is going to penetrate in, prize it up and have a look.
Tilt n turns are horrible things at the best of times, a badly fitted one will give you years of trouble

 

[DHFrames]

Doh, pics round the wrong way

 

[noelrobx]

Thanks DHFrames for all your work on this!! First though, it isn't a 'tilt and turn' door. I said that was the original door fitted but it was useless. They came back and replaced it with a simple sliding door.
(by the way, why can I see your pics but not my own?)
The big difference between the real doors and your diagrams is that there is a gap above the sill with an overhang in your diagrams but in the real doors there is no overhang or gap. If any water gets into the frame it has nowhere to go and finds its way down into the flat below.

This is driving me mad. How could they design or fit such a dreadful system?

Noel