Mouse

[geraldthehamster]

Here's a question. If the trip in one of my lighting circuits this morning was caused by a mouse trying to eat what it shouldn't (within the first floor), is the mouse likely to be dead now?

Given the wiring layout, I don't have any even remotely convenient way to discover if it was a mouse, but no bulbs have blown, and I have had my usual seasonal issues with mouse ingress this month (from the fields, to our wood shed, to the eaves of our dormer bungalow, and into the first floor under the boards).

I'm going to continue with my efforts at blocking entry and trapping any that get in; just wondered whether I'm likely to need to concern myself with this particular (conjectural) rodent any more. Bearing in mind that you can apparently kill one in an electric trap with a couple of batteries (not that I've tried anything as technological as that).

Cheers
Richard

 

[JohnW2]

Here's a question. If the trip in one of my lighting circuits this morning was caused by a mouse trying to eat what it shouldn't (within the first floor), is the mouse likely to be dead now?

Possibly, but not necessarily.

Given the wiring layout, I don't have any even remotely convenient way to discover if it was a mouse, but no bulbs have blown, and I have had my usual seasonal issues with mouse ingress this month (from the fields, to our wood shed, to the eaves of our dormer bungalow, and into the first floor under the boards).

There are countless reasons why 'trips' can occur, and it is really just a wild guess that rodents could be the cause. What tripped - an RCD (with test button) or an MCB? I presume that it was not associated with a lamp/bulb dying?

If trips recur, then you probably should get an electrician to investigate. Unfortunately, rodent damage can often be undetectable by testing, unless 'disturbed' (perhaps by the rodents themselves), as per this:

Kind Regards, John

 

[geraldthehamster]

There are countless reasons why 'trips' can occur, and it is really just a wild guess that rodents could be the cause. What tripped - an RCD (with test button) or an MCB? I presume that it was not associated with a lamp/bulb dying?

More than a wild guess. They get in under the eaves and under the bedroom floorboards. In the past fortnight I've trapped 11, and also aimed a quantity of expanding foam at likely points of ingress - precisely because of the amount of wiring and plastic pipe under that floor. They've already eaten chunks out of the foam insulation on some copper pipe. No bulbs on that circuit (or any other circuit) died. It was an MCB.

Cheers
Richard

 

[JohnW2]

More than a wild guess. They get in under the eaves and under the bedroom floorboards. In the past fortnight I've trapped 11, and also aimed a quantity of expanding foam at likely points of ingress - precisely because of the amount of wiring and plastic pipe under that floor. They've already eaten chunks out of the foam insulation on some copper pipe.

I'm not denying that the mice are a problem, and that they gnaw everything in sight, but there still is no certainty that they were the cause of the trip. To trip an MCB requires that there was direct contact between 'live' and neutral (or 'live' and earth) conductors for a period of time (not just current through the animal), and it takes a very special set of circumstance for that to happen 'temporarily' for just a short period of time. (I presume that you were able to reset the MCB?)

We also have a lot of trouble with rodents at this time of year but, fortunately, they have (as far as I am aware) only occasionally done damage to mains wiring cables. Our experience is that they appear to be far more 'partial' to telephone, ethernet, alam and TV cables etc. - so it is usually them that suffer first!

My advice remains the same - that if you suffer further trips that you should probably get an electrician to do some investigation and testing (albeit the caveats I mentioned before)

Kind Regards, John

 

[geraldthehamster]

Thanks John. I'm reassured that you think a mouse is not the primary suspect It was just that most of my wiring was renewed about 7 years ago, and I don't recall anything tripping before without an associated blowing lightbulb. I was in the downstairs bathroom at the time (6.15 this morning so I'm a bit hazy on the details) and assumed at first that the bulb in that ceiling had blown (it hadn't), because there was an associated phutty-bangy noise which seemed to be from overhead.

Cheers
Richard

 

[JohnW2]

Thanks John. I'm reassured that you think a mouse is not the primary suspect

I haven't really said that - merely that mice are by no means the only possible explanation!

It was just that most of my wiring was renewed about 7 years ago, and I don't recall anything tripping before without an associated blowing lightbulb. I was in the downstairs bathroom at the time (6.15 this morning so I'm a bit hazy on the details) and assumed at first that the bulb in that ceiling had blown (it hadn't), because there was an associated phutty-bangy noise which seemed to be from overhead.

Fair enough - but that phutty-bangy nose certainly suggests that something may have happened to the wiring or its connections - which is a good reason for having it checked out by an electrician.

Kind Regards, John

 

[geraldthehamster]

Fair enough - but that phutty-bangy nose certainly suggests that something may have happened to the wiring or its connections - which is a good reason for having it checked out by an electrician. Kind Regards, John

Yes, I know :-/ trouble is even if testing did show anything, the fault would be hard to locate, as the wiring was done before the floors and the upstairs bathroom went in. Ah well. I'll probably wait and see if it happens again, and in the mean time have faith in my circuit breakers.

Thanks again

Richard

 

[JohnW2]

Yes, I know :-/ trouble is even if testing did show anything, the fault would be hard to locate, as the wiring was done before the floors and the upstairs bathroom went in. Ah well. I'll probably wait and see if it happens again, and in the mean time have faith in my circuit breakers.

That's one approach, and probably the one I would suggest if it had been an RCD which had tripped. I would personally be less comfortable continuing to live with something which had caused an MCB to trip (even if only once) - not only does it take a lot of current to do that (suggesting some real significant fault), but the high current itself, even if only brief, can itself do further damage.

Kind Regards, John

 

[geraldthehamster]

That's one approach, and probably the one I would suggest if it had been an RCD which had tripped. I would personally be less comfortable continuing to live with something which had caused an MCB to trip (even if only once) - not only does it take a lot of current to do that (suggesting some real significant fault), but the high current itself, even if only brief, can itself do further damage.

Thanks, point taken.

 

[Lectrician]

The rodents will soon eat their way through expanding foam! Scrunched up chicken wire stuffed in the hole, then filled with expanding foam is a well used approach.

 

[geraldthehamster]

The rodents will soon eat their way through expanding foam! Scrunched up chicken wire stuffed in the hole, then filled with expanding foam is a well used approach.

Didn't think of chicken wire but I'll bear it in mind for the future. One had certainly made it through the foam this morning (unless it was already on the inside). I heard loud scritting about followed by a trap going off (overhead as I sat on the loo downstairs). At least I think it was a trap. I heard a few seconds of thrashing about, followed by silence, so I hope the b4stard hasn't electrocuted itself on a nice bit of twin & earth. Haven't had time to investigate as I was on the way to work.

Cheers
Richard

 

[JohnW2]

The rodents will soon eat their way through expanding foam! Scrunched up chicken wire stuffed in the hole, then filled with expanding foam is a well used approach.

Indeed, we've used that approach quite a lot. However, rats can sometimes get through even that!

Kind Regards, John

 

[bernardgreen]

Didn't think of chicken wire but I'll bear it in mind for the future

Mice can get through very small holes. 20 mm wire mesh is no barrier to them.

 

[geraldthehamster]

Mice can get through very small holes. 20 mm wire mesh is no barrier to them.

Yes, you'd need a finer mesh than that

 

[Taylortwocities]

They can get into the most unbelievable places

That's what is known as a live tail