pakistan

[oilman]

In the early colonial days in Africa, the numbers may have been small by today's standards, but you will have heard of the expression ".......hammer the natives". Used against resisting tribes.

 

[Freddie]

In the early colonial days in Africa, the numbers may have been small by today's standards, but you will have heard of the expression ".......hammer the natives". Used against resisting tribes.

I honestly have never heard of this Oilman can you give me some examples i could look up on the net maybe as i am big into history from Roukes Drift onwards.

 

[user56565]

......the pakistani government has in the past, been a strong supporter for the taliban regime in afghanistan.

they supported the taliban up until only a 3/4 years ago. why would anyone support the taliban?? only if they sympathised with the cause ie extremist islam. pakistan couldn't have just instantly 'changed' its mind on something as fundamental as that. so its only natural to assume they changed their offical position because they had no choice (military/diplomatic/economic pressure), and very likely continue to hold such strong views in private.

 

[Big_Spark]

Freddie, why do you think the Zulu raised up against the British?

Why do you think many Tribes in Africa suffered population crashes after the British arrived..

However i would point out this all occured at a time when peoples thinking was different, when Human rights was non-existant and Victorian Britain thought they had some God given right to rule the world.

They may not be right by todays' standards, but we should not forget that no nation is innocent of atrocities in History.

But two wrongs' do not make a right!

 

[Freddie]

I never thought what upset the Zulu's, i just thought it was Michael Cane in a Butlins Uniform

 

[Slogger]

india will sort pakistan out if they dont get there house in order with the backing of the uk and usa

 

[Stoday]

You ought to go back a few hours and 8 miles from Rorkes Drift to the battle of Isandhlwana. That's where the Zulus kicked the s**t out of the British.

Got our own back at Rorkes Drift though. Funny how victories are remembered, but defeats forgotten...

 

[kendor]

......the pakistani government has in the past, been a strong supporter for the taliban regime in afghanistan.

they supported the taliban up until only a 3/4 years ago. why would anyone support the taliban?? only if they sympathised with the cause ie extremist islam. pakistan couldn't have just instantly 'changed' its mind on something as fundamental as that. so its only natural to assume they changed their offical position because they had no choice (military/diplomatic/economic pressure), and very likely continue to hold such strong views in private.

So did the west when they supported them to fight the Russians, so your point is a bit lost here i'm afraid.

 

[user56565]

So did the west when they supported them to fight the Russians, so your point is a bit lost here i'm afraid.

i don't think you've thought this through, which is why you haven't understood the point kendor. the west supported the taliban to fight the russians. the west only did this for military and strategic reasons. are you suggesting the west supports the cause of extremist islam, based on the above action??
pakistan had no such reason to support the taliban, only ideological.

why would anyone support the taliban?? only if they sympathised with the cause ie extremist islam. pakistan couldn't have just instantly 'changed' its mind on something as fundamental as that. so its only natural to assume they changed their offical position because they had no choice (military/diplomatic/economic pressure), and very likely continue to hold such strong views in private.

now see the following links:
http://www.washtimes.com/upi-breaking/20040826-031202-5107r.htm

Jean Arnault, the head of UNAMA, in a briefing to the U.N. Security Council this week, specifically called for action "against those who plan and organize these attacks," from across the border. Arnault had just revealed what has been an open secret for a long time -- Pakistan is still supporting the Taliban.

http://www.pakistan-facts.com/index.php

As President Pervez Musharraf renews his crackdown on Muslim militant factions after this month's terrorist bombings in London, new evidence has emerged that Pakistan has continued to let such groups run military-style camps to train guerrilla fighters. For years, the camps have been only half a secret. "Everybody has known they were there, but no one would officially admit it," said a Pakistani official who was interviewed recently and requested anonymity.

http://www.ipcs.org/South_Asia_arti...&kValue=828&country=1016&status=article&mod=a

Way back in 1992, Pakistan came perilously close to being declared a terrorist state by the US, after an ISI instructed attack by Kashmiri extremists on Israeli tourists in Srinagar. In 1993, Pakistan and Sudan came to figure on the ‘watch list’ of states suspected of sponsoring terrorism. Four years later, the Pakistan patronized Harkat-Ul-Ansar (HUM) was declared an international terrorist organization by the US State Department. Matters became more difficult for Pakistan with the Harkat Ul Mujahideen (the erstwhile Harkat-Ul-Ansar) ratifying Osama Bin Laden’s fatwa against the US and Israel in 1998.?

if you make a valid argument kendor, ill listen..

 

[Freddie]

You ought to go back a few hours and 8 miles from Rorkes Drift to the battle of Isandhlwana. That's where the Zulus kicked the s**t out of the British.

Got our own back at Rorkes Drift though. Funny how victories are remembered, but defeats forgotten...

They are not forgotton Stoday, the reason Roukes Drift is remembered is because there was 150 British soldiers facing over 4000 Zulus who were equally armed and this scale of odds has never been repeated ever again anywhere in the world.

One large playing factor and why the Zulu's wanted Roukes Drift is because it was the main Ammo dump so having enough bullets wasnt a problem

 

[kendor]

So did the west when they supported them to fight the Russians, so your point is a bit lost here i'm afraid.

i don't think you've thought this through, which is why you haven't understood the point kendor. the west supported the taliban to fight the russians. the west only did this for military and strategic reasons. are you suggesting the west supports the cause of extremist islam, based on the above action??
pakistan had no such reason to support the taliban, only ideological.

But i have thought it through and you are wrong if you think i misunderstood, your interpretation of what is military and strategic reasons for hiring mercenaries can be interpreted as interference and support for individuals who have since proved no allegience to the ones that hired them in the past.
To answer your question as to whether the west supports the cause of extremists the answer is no. my reply was to your quote:

......the pakistani government has in the past, been a strong supporter for the taliban regime in afghanistan.

and in your own words you say the past, not the present, same as the west have supported the taliban, in the past not the present.
And that is why i said your point is a bit lost here.

 

[user56565]

but you have misunderstood the point. which is if you support extremist islam, you don't suddenly become moderate again. which is why pakistan very likely continues to privately support the taliban. whereas the west, although they supported the taliban, they never supported extremist islam. do you see the difference???

finally the links i posted, did you read them, or skip over them?? they confirm that pakistan does still support the taliban and does show signs of being extremist.

 

[kendor]

but you have misunderstood the point. which is if you support extremist islam, you don't suddenly become moderate again. which is why pakistan very likely continues to privately support the taliban. whereas the west, although they supported the taliban, they never supported extremist islam. do you see the difference???

finally the links i posted, did you read them, or skip over them?? they confirm that pakistan does still support the taliban and does show signs of being extremist.

I can see a point you are making but i still disagree as to your interpretation of pakistan ( the government of)supporting extremeists to this day.

 

[user56565]

but i still disagree as to your interpretation of pakistan ( the government of)supporting extremeists to this day.

i didn't want to come across as pointing the finger, as i don't know all the facts. which is why i said in my first post:

pakistan shouldn't be assumed to be either a moderate country, or a secretly extremist country

however, the information in the links above for example, amongst with the other points i made, does still show signs of extremism in pakistan.

 

[kendor]

There is extremism in loads of countries of the world including this one but that doesn't mean that the authorities or the public in general are all extremeists does it?