Part P - can I fit a socket?

[Albumen]

My built-in microwave has just died. The lead from the microwave is joined to a PVC mains cable somehow (I assume a connection block), wrapped in electrical tape. The mains cable is fed from a FCU which is just to the right of the housing, and "within reach of the person operating the appliance". We were firm with electricians that the kitchen wiring had to be up to spec (it's 10 years old). In fact we sacked an electrician who wanted to put the oven isolater at the back of a cupboard.

To save time next time the microwave dies, I'm proposing to put a socket at the back of the unit (it's the plaster wall), and buy a microwave with a plug end. I know that might limit me to shallower microwaves, but there's only two of us now, so that's what I'm going to buy.

Question - am I permitted, under the various regs, to install a 13 amp socket on the end of the existing wiring? Which I assume is a spur off the ring main, as there is no separate RCD in the consumer unit.

Thanks

 

[EFLImpudence]

Yes, you can do the work if you do it properly and ensure it is safe. That is all Part P says.

You could have had the isolator in a cupboard if you wanted. There is no regulatory requirement to have one at all.
Are there any domestic microwaves supplied without a plug.
How can you assume the cable is a spur? It has nothing to do with whether there is a RCD.

 

[Murdochcat]

My built-in microwave has just died. The lead from the microwave is joined to a PVC mains cable somehow (I assume a connection block), wrapped in electrical tape. The mains cable is fed from a FCU which is just to the right of the housing, and "within reach of the person operating the appliance". We were firm with electricians that the kitchen wiring had to be up to spec (it's 10 years old). In fact we sacked an electrician who wanted to put the oven isolater at the back of a cupboard.

To save time next time the microwave dies, I'm proposing to put a socket at the back of the unit (it's the plaster wall), and buy a microwave with a plug end. I know that might limit me to shallower microwaves, but there's only two of us now, so that's what I'm going to buy.

Question - am I permitted, under the various regs, to install a 13 amp socket on the end of the existing wiring? Which I assume is a spur off the ring main, as there is no separate RCD in the consumer unit.

Thanks

placing the oven isolator in the back of a cupboard is perfectly acceptable.

 

[conny]

placing the oven isolator in the back of a cupboard is perfectly acceptable.

But inconvenient if the cupboard is loaded with tins, jars, boxes etc and you need to isolate quickly, (think chip pan/wok fire and the controls are behind the flames).

 

[EFLImpudence]

Nevertheless, there are no specific rules for the placement of items that are not required (by the regulations).

 

[Murdochcat]

But inconvenient if the cupboard is loaded with tins, jars, boxes etc and you need to isolate quickly, (think chip pan/wok fire and the controls are behind the flames).

Sacking a spark?

Surely you discussed the options with them OR was this a kitchen from a big shed and a poor spark on a fixed price?

 

[Albumen]

placing the oven isolator in the back of a cupboard is perfectly acceptable.

Not to me it wasn't.

Yes, you can do the work if you do it properly and ensure it is safe. That is all Part P says.

You could have had the isolator in a cupboard if you wanted. There is no regulatory requirement to have one at all.
Are there any domestic microwaves supplied without a plug.
How can you assume the cable is a spur? It has nothing to do with whether there is a RCD.

Every circuit in the house is protected by an RCD in the consumer unit. Maybe I should have said MCB, perhaps my use of the term RCD was confusing. Either way, there isn't any separate connection at the consumer unit for the FCU which supplies the microwave. So the microwave supply must be coming from one of the circuits connected to the consumer unit, yes? And I assume it's a spur off the ring main. It would be strange to connect it to the lighting circuit, wouldn't it? And there is a mains socket right next to the FCU. And the cable supplying the microwave is a single cable. That's what is guiding me to my assumption. Please let me know if that assumption is incorrect in some way.

 

[EFLImpudence]

So the microwave supply must be coming from one of the circuits connected to the consumer unit, yes?

Obviously.

And I assume it's a spur off the ring main.

It might be on the Ring Final Circuit and not a spur.

It would be strange to connect it to the lighting circuit, wouldn't it?

It would.

And there is a mains socket right next to the FCU. And the cable supplying the microwave is a single cable. That's what is guiding me to my assumption. Please let me know if that assumption is incorrect in some way.

You might be right but you said:

Which I assume is a spur off the ring main, as there is no separate RCD in the consumer unit.

 

[Albumen]

Sacking a spark?

Surely you discussed the options with them OR was this a kitchen from a big shed and a poor spark on a fixed price?

I am not a tradesman. But I spent 5 years in a labouring and then technical capacity in the construction industry. I have worked with some very skilled tradesmen and some terrible ones. As this is my house, and my money, I will make the decisions about who I employ. And I absolutely refuse to take tradesmen's assertions about their own competence, skill and experience as true. I've worked with enough bad ones to decide for myself whether they can do the job to my standards. I'm the paymaster, so I decide.

No, the kitchen wasn't from a "big shed". The electrician was from a local firm. He gave us a price, if I remember correctly. We discussed the positioning of the isolator. My interpretation of the regulations was that the isolator should be within easy reach of the person operating the appliance. I'm not going to seek out the regs again, I'll leave that to others. But whatever the actual wording of the regs, the comment above is a practical example of why I wanted the isolator nearby, within easy reach. If it's on fire, or some other emergency condition arises, I want to be able to turn it off, quickly. The same scenario applies even more to guests or my children. The electrician thought that having the isolator above the worktop would "look terrible". I told him that safety was more important than cosmetics to me. I paid the electrician for the work he had done. He was happy with the payment, and we parted on good terms, agreeing that we had different views on the subject.

I hope that's clear.

 

[Albumen]

Obviously.


It might be on the Ring Final Circuit and not a spur.


It would.


You might be right but you said:

Yes, you're obviously correct. Thanks.

 

[Albumen]

Thanks for the advice everybody. Having done a little more research, I think I know the position now.

Cheers.

 

[ericmark]

I can't see the country you live in, you can DIY that work in England, but not in Wales. Personally I would not worry about Part P, what you want is a safe job, but you have asked if officially you are permitted to do the work, and official answer has to be, not in Wales.

 

[JohnW2]

Personally I would not worry about Part P,

I wish you would get your terminolgy correct, and I can't imagine how many (probably hundreds!) of times we've pointed this out to you

To "not worry about Part P" would mean to "not worry" about doing things safely, since (as you know very well) ALL "Part P" says is:

“Reasonable provision shall be made in the design and installation of electrical installations in order to protect persons operating, maintaining or altering the installations from fire or injury.”

... yet you (thankfully!) obviously do not think that one should "not worry about" that, since you go on to say.

what you want is a safe job,

If you mean "notification" you should really say that, not "Part P" (and that would also spare the rest of us from having to repeatedly remind you {for the sake of other readers} )

Kind Regards, John

 

[Nope]

The electrician thought that having the isolator above the worktop would "look terrible".

Surely he could have selected something nice looking if he was THAT worried about how it looked….

I’ve done a bit of DIY electrical work myself (as some people on this site will be aware) and I’ve always selected nice looking faceplates for switches and sockets etc. In fact, just recently we got some rooms decorated and Mrs SamH82 asked me if I would be competent and confident enough to replace a couple of outdated looking brass switches for something more modern. I selected some sleek, slimline switches (try saying that one fast) to replace them with and when Mrs came to inspect my work she described them as “pretty”.