Socket orientation

[whyme!]

I want to have sockets for appliances mounted in a dado type trunking but on the floor behind kitchen units ( fits the void better than the 3 compartment skirting trunking). The only issue is it is too tight to actually plug something in with sockets the ( normal way up), flex too tight. Can These just be rotated 180 deg i.e upside down so appliance then plugs in nicely? Aesthetically it does not matter as they will not be seen

 

[Tigercubrider]

no idea if it was done at build, but a cousin lived in a new enough house in swindon that the roads were not finished, in the mid 80's.
we noticed that all the sockets (at least downstairs) were "upside down" which made sense for more items than traditional orientation.
leads fell off work surfaces and went to the wall.

 

[whyme!]

It makes more sense for me really as cables from appliances will be coming down from above.

 

[JohnW2]

Can These just be rotated 180 deg i.e upside down so appliance then plugs in nicely? Aesthetically it does not matter as they will not be seen

Some manufacturers may possibly recommended against it, but I can see no electrical problem (and have seen it done sometimes) - and it is clearly preferable/'safer' if the alternative would be to have some nasty bends in the appliance cables.

With some makes of socket, you might find it slightly more difficult to wire them, since the terminals are sometimes positioned and designed so that one applies one's screwdriver 'from above' (when the socket is 'normally orientated' - hence 'from below' if inverted).

Kind Regards, John

 

[whyme!]

So maybe at 90 deg it would allow easier access to terminals and allow the flex cables with plugs to fit nicely. Thanks John

 

[JohnW2]

So maybe at 90 deg it would allow easier access to terminals and allow the flex cables with plugs to fit nicely. Thanks John

Yes, that's another possibility. I presume you're talking about single sockets?

Kind Regards, John

 

[ban-all-sheds]

With some makes of socket, you might find it slightly more difficult to wire them, since the terminals are sometimes positioned and designed so that one applies one's screwdriver 'from above' (when the socket is 'normally orientated' - hence 'from below' if inverted).

It's in trunking.

Singles could be used, and enough slack tucked inside to allow the sockets to be positioned for ease of wiring.

Or get powertrack/busbar type trunking and install it upside down.

 

[flameport]

dado type trunking but on the floor behind kitchen units

Why use that very expensive option in a place no one will ever see it?

 

[whyme!]

Yes, that's another possibility. I presume you're talking about single sockets?

Kind Regards, John

Yes singles

Why use that very expensive option in a place no one will ever see it?

£15 a length of 100 x 50 appeared good value, cheap enough and prevented me having to have cables buried in a wall, I utilised the void behind kitchen units

 

[Iggifer]

Yes singles

£15 a length of 100 x 50 appeared good value, cheap enough and prevented me having to have cables buried in a wall, I utilised the void behind kitchen units

But you could have used a bit of 25x16 Mini Trunking for £2 and a couple of single patresses for about £1 each and it would have taken up less space

 

[whyme!]

But you could have used a bit of 25x16 Mini Trunking for £2 and a couple of single patresses for about £1 each and it would have taken up less space

Very true, although I have quite a few cables in this trunking, room to breath. Oh well maybe next time

 

[ban-all-sheds]

Larger plain trunking is available.

 

[ericmark]

It is not the socket that has a problem it is the plug, the IP rating from above has to be IPXXD or IP4X but all other directions IPXXB or IP2X so the cable entry of the plug is only IPXXB or IP2X with rewire-able plugs so the socket must be positioned so the cable entry is not from above. So OK to rotate 90° or to mount flat on the floor, but not 180° as some one could plug in items where the cable entry hole is too big.

553.1.6 A socket-outlet on a wall or similar structure shall be mounted at a height above the floor or any working surface to minimize the risk of mechanical damage to the socket-outlet or to an associated plug and its flexible cord which might be caused during insertion, use or withdrawal of the plug.

I can't see any reason why they should not be rotated 90° but not a 180°.

 

[JohnW2]

It is not the socket that has a problem it is the plug, the IP rating from above has to be IPXXD or IP4X but all other directions IPXXB or IP2X so the cable entry of the plug is only IPXXB or IP2X with rewire-able plugs so the socket must be positioned so the cable entry is not from above. So OK to rotate 90° or to mount flat on the floor, but not 180° as some one could plug in items where the cable entry hole is too big.

Interesting point, which I must admit I hadn't thought about.

Those regulations relate to "barriers and enclosures", which I suppose does include the cases of plugs. As you imply, although the design of some plugs is such that one could not touch live parts by poking a straight 1mm diameter object through the cable entry hole (as per IPXXD), with some (maybe many) it probably would be possible.

The regulation requiring IPXXD or IP4X on the top surface relates to barriers and enclosures which are "readily accessible", and I suppose there could be some discussion as to whether the OP's plugs/sockets 'behind kitchen units' would qualify as "readily accessible".

This is all really about strict compliance with regulations. In common sense terms, I don't think there is any significant risk of anyone getting behind kitchen units and poking a 1mm conductor through the cable entry hole of a plug. In practical terms, I doubt that the OP's sockets would be sufficiently "readily accessible" (i.e. not even "readily visible") for someone undertaking an EICR to be able to ascertain their orientation!

Kind Regards, John

 

[ericmark]

I would agree, since within an enclosure it is same as using Schuko sockets inside an enclosure does not maybe strictly comply but well all know quite common to allow charging of a PC when altering PLC programming on equipment imported from Germany.

However these threads stay up for years, and are found with Google searches so it does need a note some where to say it could be deemed as non compliment. Although not the socket, it is the plug, not tried fitting sockets sidewards, don't know if they would fit? Sockets like the LAP grid ones are square and dado trunking does seem to use similar sockets, but MK clearly not possible.

However with that design can't see how you could mount low enough to cause the cable to be bent too sharp anyway, if you did mount upside down you would want the cable with a U so any moisture running down the cable would not run into the plug. There are some plugs which don't have bottom entry

we used them on vacuum cleaners (air velocity they should be called before Wilson pulls me up) as does not matter how long of a lead the user always seems to want to go a little further and damage plug and socket by pulling on cable.

There was a plug with a handle which had a top entry but not seen for years, I have one socket which is mounted right above a windowsill normal plugs fit OK even if cable is a bit tight but can't use any walmart plugs.