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Dimmer Wiring

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pinheadplanet

from United Kingdom

Joined: 22 Feb 2008
Posts: 124
Location: Southampton,
United Kingdom

PostPosted: Fri Mar 30, 2012 6:28 pm Reply with quote

riveralt wrote:
pinheadplanet wrote:
So where do I go from here?
Should I put normal switches upstairs and retain a single dimmer downstairs, should that solve it?

Personally speaking I wouldn't let dimmers go anywhere near the stairs/landing area - but if you insist then if you have a single gang 2 way switch then replace it with a single gang 2 way dimmer.


Eh??? You've lost me, I don't have any switches, they're all dimmers...
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riveralt

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PostPosted: Fri Mar 30, 2012 6:36 pm Reply with quote

pinheadplanet wrote:
riveralt wrote:
pinheadplanet wrote:
So where do I go from here?
Should I put normal switches upstairs and retain a single dimmer downstairs, should that solve it?

Personally speaking I wouldn't let dimmers go anywhere near the stairs/landing area - but if you insist then if you have a single gang 2 way switch then replace it with a single gang 2 way dimmer.


Eh??? You've lost me, I don't have any switches, they're all dimmers...

I thought you said you had a double dimmer upstairs and a single dimmer downstairs.
In any case either replace the double dimmer upstairs with a double gang 2 way rocker switch or leave the dimmer upstairs and replace the downstairs dimmer with a single gang 2 way rocker switch. One dimmer on one circuit unless you have a master/slave system.
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pinheadplanet

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Joined: 22 Feb 2008
Posts: 124
Location: Southampton,
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 31, 2012 10:33 am Reply with quote

This is the switch from a 1 way light in the kitchen, I was going to try it upstairs replacing the dimmer so I only had one dimmer (downstairs) on my two way set up, before i went out and bought a new one but IS THIS A 1 WAY ONLY SWITCH?

And if it is I guess that means I can't test it upstairs to replace the dimmer (or can i?)

kitchen switch
kitchen switch


Thanks

PS the upstairs dimmer looks like this

upstairs double dimmer
upstairs double dimmer
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vibrobullit407

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PostPosted: Sat Mar 31, 2012 10:47 am Reply with quote

pinheadplanet wrote:


kitchen switch
kitchen switch


That looks like the back of a 2 gang 2 way switch to me! icon_wink.gif

That should fit in the double dimmer position.
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pinheadplanet

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Joined: 22 Feb 2008
Posts: 124
Location: Southampton,
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 31, 2012 10:55 am Reply with quote

Whilst waiting for a reply I thought I'd try it using the same wiring set up as in the original upstairs dimmer:

2 way hallway light
Red - C
yellow - L2
Blue - L1

1 way landing light
Red - C
Black - L1

IT DIDN"T WORK!

Am I right in saying the Kitchen switch IS a 1 way only and therefore won't work? And I'll just have to go buy a 2 gang 2 way rocker switch?
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pinheadplanet

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Location: Southampton,
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 31, 2012 10:57 am Reply with quote

vibrobullit407 wrote:


That looks like the back of a 2 gang 2 way switch to me! icon_wink.gif

That should fit in the double dimmer position.


Do I need to wire it differently then?
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vibrobullit407

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PostPosted: Sat Mar 31, 2012 11:57 am Reply with quote

pinheadplanet wrote:
Whilst waiting for a reply I thought I'd try it using the same wiring set up as in the original upstairs dimmer:

2 way hallway light
Red - C
yellow - L2
Blue - L1

1 way landing light
Red - C
Black - L1

IT DIDN"T WORK!

Am I right in saying the Kitchen switch IS a 1 way only and therefore won't work? And I'll just have to go buy a 2 gang 2 way rocker switch?


For the one way switch you need to put the red into C and the black into L1. For the 2 way put the red into C, yellow into L2 and blue into L1. You are putting them into the correct terminals for the switch aren't you i.e not like in the dimmer where the terminals are in a line. On the rocker switch the terminals are in a triangle formation with C, L1 & L2.
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pinheadplanet (31 Mar 2012)
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riveralt

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PostPosted: Sat Mar 31, 2012 11:59 am Reply with quote

pinheadplanet wrote:


Do I need to wire it differently then?

Having re-read what you have written in your original post its uncertain how the hallway two way system is geting its power - since you appear to have only connected the three core cables between the upstairs and downstairs switches.

You need to photograph the rear of the upstairs double gang switch with the cables intact. The one you have provided is not clear enough to see how the upstairs/downstairs switches are powered.

If there isn't a borrowed neutral involved the cables should be something like this:
Upstairs switch controlling the upstairs light only: Red (live) = Common and Black (switch live) = L1. This should operate the landing light.
Upstairs switch controlling the hallways light should have three core cable (red = C, blue =L1 and yellow= L2) and the downstairs switch the same - It doesn't matter which terminal each colour goes into AS LONG as they are the same in both switches.
We now have the strappers between the two 2 way switches.
Next you need to get the live and switch live to the switch.
At the down stairs switch you should have a second T&E cable (red/black) which brings the power from the downstairs ceiling rose (light) to the hallway switch.
The red goes in L1 (together with the blue) the black goes in L2 (together with the yellow).
If this arrangement is not in place then we need to see the rear wiring arrangement of the upstairs switch - because it is possible you have a borrowed neutral.
Look at wiki for two way lighting.
http://www.diynot.com/wiki/electrics:lighting:two_way_lighting:lrnonharm
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pinheadplanet (31 Mar 2012)
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pinheadplanet

from United Kingdom

Joined: 22 Feb 2008
Posts: 124
Location: Southampton,
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 31, 2012 12:14 pm Reply with quote

vibrobullit407 wrote:


For the one way switch you need to put the red into C and the black into L1. For the 2 way put the red into C, yellow into L2 and blue into L1. You are putting them into the correct terminals for the switch aren't you i.e not like in the dimmer where the terminals are in a line. On the rocker switch the terminals are in a triangle formation with C, L1 & L2.


Vibro do you have an Uncle called Bob?

Bob's ya uncle, you were spot on, I had put the wiring linear instead of triangular. I just rewired it and it all works (with the original switches that I had moved around from other rooms).

I'm now going to try it with the new dimmer I bought to check if that will work properly on this circuit too
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vibrobullit407

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PostPosted: Sat Mar 31, 2012 12:23 pm Reply with quote

double post!
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vibrobullit407

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PostPosted: Sat Mar 31, 2012 12:23 pm Reply with quote

riveralt wrote:
pinheadplanet wrote:


Do I need to wire it differently then?

Having re-read what you have written in your original post its uncertain how the hallway two way system is geting its power - since you appear to have only connected the three core cables between the upstairs and downstairs switches.

You need to photograph the rear of the upstairs double gang switch with the cables intact. The one you have provided is not clear enough to see how the upstairs/downstairs switches are powered.

If there isn't a borrowed neutral involved the cables should be something like this:
Upstairs switch controlling the upstairs light only: Red (live) = Common and Black (switch live) = L1. This should operate the landing light.
Upstairs switch controlling the hallways light should have three core cable (red = C, blue =L1 and yellow= L2) and the downstairs switch the same - It doesn't matter which terminal each colour goes into AS LONG as they are the same in both switches.
We now have the strappers between the two 2 way switches.
Next you need to get the live and switch live to the switch.
At the down stairs switch you should have a second T&E cable (red/black) which brings the power from the downstairs ceiling rose (light) to the hallway switch.
The red goes in L1 (together with the blue) the black goes in L2 (together with the yellow).
If this arrangement is not in place then we need to see the rear wiring arrangement of the upstairs switch - because it is possible you have a borrowed neutral.
Look at wiki for two way lighting.
http://www.diynot.com/wiki/electrics:lighting:two_way_lighting:lrnonharm


I think what the op was explaining was the one way lighting circuit incorporated within the 2 gang upstairs switch. Landing light not part of the 2 way circuit.
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pinheadplanet

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Joined: 22 Feb 2008
Posts: 124
Location: Southampton,
United Kingdom

PostPosted: Sat Mar 31, 2012 12:24 pm Reply with quote

Bingo! Yeap that works, the new dimmer I bought works when there's a rocker switch upstairs but it didn't when there was a dimmer upstairs. However another dimmer switch did work when there was another dimmer upstairs. Doesn't make any sense to me, but then why should it...

Thanks everyone, going to go and buy a new rocker for upstairs and hopefully that'll be the end of it
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Iggifer

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PostPosted: Sat Mar 31, 2012 12:25 pm Reply with quote

riveralt wrote:

Having re-read what you have written in your original post its uncertain how the hallway two way system is geting its power - since you appear to have only connected the three core cables between the upstairs and downstairs switches.




This wiring method would explain only 3 cores at each switch
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pinheadplanet

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Joined: 22 Feb 2008
Posts: 124
Location: Southampton,
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 31, 2012 3:29 pm Reply with quote

SON OF A **** !!! icon_cry.gif

I just bought a new 2 gang 2 way rocker switch to replace the upstairs dimmer switch seeing as the test unit I used from the Kitchen worked, BUT THE NEW ONE DON"T WORK! ARRRGGGHHHHHHH!

Here's the two switches

L Kitchen R New
L Kitchen R New


On the left we have the Kitchen Switch that worked and on the right the new switch that don't. They are slightly different to each other as the new switch doesn't have a C port it just L1 L2 and L3.

What I did was to wire everything up the same but putting the wire that came out of the C port into the L3 port, so:

1 way landing switch
Red - L3
Black - L1

2 way Hallway switch
Red - L3
Yellow - L2
Blue - L1

What happened was the single dimmer downstairs worked but when you went upstairs and switched the switched it didn't turn off the light (when it was on downstairs, if anything it made it brighter).

I'm sure it just the case of it requiring some different wiring connection but what? This just doesn't make any sense to me anymore. Help!

Thanks
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EFLImpudence

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PostPosted: Sat Mar 31, 2012 4:51 pm Reply with quote

C = L1
L1 = L2
L2 = L3

Apart from the lettering, they're exactly the same.
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pinheadplanet (31 Mar 2012)
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