Ecoflam minor 1 models and "Burbling" B52 burner

Stuartt · 14 Oct 2009

Hi,

I've been looking around on the internet for ages and I cant seem to find an answer to this question.... I hope someone here can help me out!

I've got a Thermecon wall mount boiler with a : Minor 1 "300" H.E.B. 50/80 burner. I'm considering replacing the whole burner however I dont know if the replacement Minor 1 would fit.

Ive tried a Minor 1 50/80 and the burner is slightly proud of the boiler case - 3 of the 4 catches fit.

I've got the manual for this Minor 1 "300" and the depth of the burner is 295mm - does the 300 mean depth?

A Minor 1.1 has a depth of 309mm.

Any idea's of a suitable replacement or should I learn to live with a boiler door that doesnt fully close? lol

At the moment the burner lights but after a few minutes it makes a back firing noise and then trys to relight. Sometimes this will be ok, othertimes it might need 2 or 3 goes to get upto temperature - oh and its getting worse. I've also noticed its "burbling" everytime like a B52 bomber when its lighting - is it running too rich?

Thanks in advance

Stuart

cider · 14 Oct 2009

presume the fact your in shetland is why you dont get someone to look at it?
I you do replace the complete burner it will still need setting up and may not work at all.

Stuartt · 14 Oct 2009

Thanks for your reply,

I'm hoping to get someone out soon.

I was mainly wondering about which model to replace it with - when the final push "to throw it in the bucket" comes lol I can then present it to the engineer and say "I've got a gift, please fit it".

Thankfully I've got an open coal fire too!

Boilerman2 · 14 Oct 2009

Talk to GAH (the manufacturer) the repalcement for the obsolete Minor Burner is the Ecoflam MAX 1, and a much better unit it is too

Your existing burner should be ok if you get a competent oil engineer in to set it up properly, sounds like the burner may be suffering from fuel starvation to me, have you checked the oil filter/s and fire valve??

Is your Wall mount a 40/50 or a 50/80 model?

Stuartt · 14 Oct 2009

Its a wall mount 50/80. The oil level is a little low but still has 300+ litres in it. Very plausable though.

Interestingly, after a complete cool down this afternoon, tonight it seemed to be running OK - burning for 10+mins - without a relight until the unit warmed up. As soon as everything warmed up it seemed to complain again. I let it cool down for 2hrs and once again it had a 10+min burn without any issues - until it warmed up.

Thanks for the MAX1 advise - I'll dig up some engineering drawings and see if it will fit. I dont really want to replace the burner but its good to have a backup option.

Thanks again guys!

oilman · 14 Oct 2009

Having a spare burner might be a good plan in your situation.

However, the old one can be made to work. What exactly is the problem/symptoms with your burner?

Stuartt · 14 Oct 2009

Hi,

For a while, each time its been lighting its been making a B52 rumble. it was suggested it was running lean due to the wind/air flow.

But this past couple of days, and getting worse, its been lighting ok (doing the normal Brummm sound), running for quite a few minutes OK, it then makes a "back firing" sound, like a pop. The fan keeps running OK. It then relights automatically and goes through the purge phase as normal. If it gets upto temperature then it shuts off as normal but it has been recently needing 2, 3, 4+ relights to get upto temperature.

Ive noticed that just before it back fires, its making the rumbling sound - like the flame is pulsing.

Also, after I let it cool for 2+hrs, the first burn upto temperature goes ok. Subsequent burns require a relight, then 2 relights, then more and more - by that time I turn it off and let it cool.

Some people have suggested to me its running too lean. Some suggest its too rich and has reduced the exhaust flow in the baffles cause they're caked in soot.

Like you I think it can be made to work, but as you say, a backup would be a nice option.

Thanks.

Stuartt · 14 Oct 2009

BoilerMan2 - thanks for your suggestions of the Max1.

I've found a manual and compared the dimensions. Height of the installed Max1 is the same, the width is a bit less - atleast it should fit! And all the mid points etc are all the same.

Only 1 issue - appologies if im being a complete newbie, but the blast tube length is 90mm while the old minor1 is 52mm (all according to the 2 Ecoflam manuals). Can and should they be swapped over?

(I've checked the 52mm blast tube part number and its actually a 72mm tube as 20mm ish fits inside the burner)

The width of the 2 blast tubes are the same. Do you think the MAX1 with a blast tube swap is still a option?

Thanks again. I was starting to think i was joining the Ecoflam suicide watch list as previously discussed on the forum!!!

Boilerman2 · 15 Oct 2009

GAH Can supply a MAX 1 Burner matched to your Boiler, it will even have a wiring loom and a socket to plug straight into the Boiler control panel!!!

IT WILL FIT GAH MADE YOUR BOILER IN THE FIRST PLACE!!

and NO you can't fit a Minor 1 -300 Head to a Max its a diffrent animal

Stuartt · 15 Oct 2009

Yeah I thought the GAH manual looked suspiciously like my Thermecon manual! lol

Thanks again for your help, I really appreciate it.

The backfiring has seemed to go away today but I dont trust it as far as I can throw it. I'll be getting someone in ASAP - prob needs a service and a re-setup.

Stuart

oilman · 15 Oct 2009

If I understand correctly, your burner is making a hell of a noise (B52s are noisy). If that's the case, then it is likely to be motor bearings. Change the bearings, and the coupling while you have it in pieces.

The bearings are 6206-2RS and 6206-2Z. Don't use cheap bearings.

Stuartt · 15 Oct 2009

Thanks oilman.... but the B52 rumble is when the burner lights/fires/ignites during normal usage and also during relight after a backfire.

The fan, motor etc during the initial stages of getting upto pressure etc, the first 10 secs before of a light up are nice and quiet.
Its only when the flame catches/ignites when the spark is produced is when its making a "Bhhhrruuummm" sound.

oilman · 16 Oct 2009

You need to measure the oil pressure. The noise could be to do with the coupling slipping under load. It should be around 100psi.

Dick Puller · 16 Oct 2009

Do you have air in your oil fuel line?? Is the oil line check valve OK?

Stuartt · 20 Oct 2009

Hi guys,

Firstly thanks for all your input....

I've managed to get an engineer round. The problems was that it was running REALLY rich and was sooted up to hell and back. He's cleaned it up, changed the nozzle - a new one - setup the mix, got the CO2 dead on at 10.5% (supposed to be 10-11%), ppm is about right, pump pressure is 100 psi and its now burning ok.

However, its still burbling on start up.

To get the startup burbling down he can make it much richer but then the CO2 is wrong.

We're thinking its the oil solinoid. When looking at the pressure its 100 psi when its running. But when its firing up its slightly moving perhaps 80-110psi. It only does this slight fluctuation for perhaps 1 or 2 seconds and ONLY at light up.

He's thinking it could be the oil solinoid - not opening cleanly. Does this seem like a possible culprit? The pump is only 18 months old though.

Thanks again

Stuart

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Ecoflam minor 1 models and "Burbling" B52 burner

Dick Puller

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