An interesting read

[ban-all-sheds]

No requirement for that, it is part of SP's system and part of the M in PME

I know....

Surprised they didn't use thermite welding though, if they like toys to play with...

 

[andrew1210]

See by that point it was half past two, nearing home time! haha

 

[andrew1210]

Hello everyone, I'm seeking a little bit of advice now. SP were back the whole of today and have determined that the fault is in another property and is 'backfeeding' into the supply. A few others in the street also said yes they were getting trips for no reason also, but not as bad as us.

It seemed today that the current on the earth wire BEFORE the service head, increases or decreases in line with the load we're pulling from the grid. The same is also happening in others houses. 8 engineers today could not get there head around where to go next.

Now we hit the catch 22. SP are now saying that if the fault is internal to another property there is really nothing they can do to sort it out. Also as our house has continually been checked and a seperate Earth provided by means of an Earth Rod, we're 'in the clear' also.

So now leads me to the question. Since this 'fault' is affecting my supply into the my property, could I argue that it IS SP's responsibility to sort this out as at the end of the day, as a DNO, they have to supply me with a stable, reliable, safe and working supply. OK the fault is maybe not on there grid, but oblivious to this, they are not meeting there obligation to provide a supply to that spec. Could I argue this?

The final bombshell was that yes there are Earth wires on the poles (order top to bottom is PH1, PH2, PH3, Street Light (unused), neutral, earth) SP do not provide the earths to property's as such, we are the only house with an Earth spike, but are still affected by the problems.

So, they say IQA are on to it now, and there is not much more they can do . I'm at my wits end now and can see this reaching minor legal proceedings

Thanks again

edit: Spell chequer showed spelling mist aches lol

 

[westie101]

SP under ESQCR have the power (well we do in Englend) to require customers whose wiring is faulty and unsafe and affecting the supply to other customers to bring it up to standard, if the customer fails to do this they have the power to disconnect that supply.
They will have this power as it is one that goes back to some of the first Supply Regulations.

 

[andrew1210]

Thanks for the quick reply. They've all ran away or I would have showed them this. As it stands, It's back in the hands of IQA to investigate. I think the problem is that the problem exists but it could be 'anywhere' according to them in any of the 120 odd on the tranny. I'm really stuck now as what to do next. If theres nothing more I can do to my property except get up and move then really it's up to them......

I give in.

 

[JohnW2]

Now we hit the catch 22. SP are now saying that if the fault is internal to another property there is really nothing they can do to sort it out. .... So now leads me to the question. Since this 'fault' is affecting my supply into the my property, could I argue that it IS SP's responsibility to sort this out as at the end of the day, as a DNO, they have to supply me with a stable, reliable, safe and working supply. OK the fault is maybe not on there grid, but oblivious to this, they are not meeting there obligation to provide a supply to that spec. Could I argue this?

I most certainly would be arguing that very strongly. They surely have a contractual duty to provide you with a satisfactory and safe supply. If something in someone else's house is preventing them doing that, they've surely either got to sort it out themselves, require that someone else to get it sorted out or disconnect them?

... and nor do I understand why, if their theory is right (sopunds a little odd to me!), they can't fairly easy identify this 'another property' which is allegedly the source of the problem.

I reckon you could make a full-length film out of this one, and it's not even sorted yet

Kind Regards, John.

 

[andrew1210]

Yes i know! reality tv series! I just cannot understand why this has went on so long. Since speaking here I phoned SP five mins ago and fought through to a manager, then asked for his manager, then again etc! someone is calling me back in "a wee while"

I warned them that they better phone back or the s**t will hit the fan.
You seen first hand from the pics the mess and inconvenience this has caused and I'm sick to the back teeth of it. I'm now phoning multiple times, daily, until this is sorted out

 

[rebuke]

I'm a bit confused here - you say they are reading a current on the incoming earth, what are they measuring that against (i.e. if one probe of whatever they're using to measure is connected to incoming earth, where is the second one going)?

If it's to some sort of 'true' earth, then surely the only way another property could be backfeeding is if they've got their own local generator of some sort, as otherwise any current they return in to earth/neutral from their phase should be going back to the transformer (unless I've completely misunderstood something), as such the faulty supply neutral theory makes more sense - the current can find a better path back to the transformer through whatever connection to 'true' earth you have than via the neutral/earth cable, hence it does so...

 

[andrew1210]

@rebuke - I don't actually know myself anymore, I've lost track, so many different theories. basically, it's like a multimeter, with a "ring" attached to the other end that is clipped over the main earth at the MET to surround the cable. This is with the DNO fuse removed. The meter shows anything from 1-7A continually fluctuating (baring in mind, dno fuse is out at this time)

And bearing in mind, we now have our own Earth spike.

Also, the RCD is also tripping as the dno fuse is breaking contact when removing

 

[andrew1210]

OK, possible progress! The head of complaints phoned me back, and extremely helpful woman who spent 40 minutes writing the whole story down and inputting it into their 'system'. So now she is personally going to go over this with the head of customer services tomorrow and between them and the technical faults team, a 'way forward' plan will be developed.

By God it's good knowing it's all down on their system. If I had to read the whole story out once more!!!!!!

Anyways, we'll see what transpires!

Thanks all

 

[cozycats]

I've been following this fascinating thread and to follow 'rebuke's' suggestion could (I've no idea) a badly installed solar system, poss with backup batteries and inverter cause this 'feedback' ? I was thinking along the lines of a DIY trying to get the FIT

 

[andrew1210]

I've been following this fascinating thread and to follow 'rebuke's' suggestion could (I've no idea) a badly installed solar system, poss with backup batteries and inverter cause this 'feedback' ? I was thinking along the lines of a DIY trying to get the FIT

You know, it's something they've never metioned. I've been basically hearing it all being the typical "nosey homeowner" (lol) and this is something that has never arisen. Although there is only three streets attached to the tranny (120 houses in total) and as I can see, no one has any form of renewable energy although this could still be possible.

Awaiting a call back from the head of customer complaints/relations and head of technical operations and we'll see where it goes from there!

Although, as a side point, since this new cable went in, the two people in the block after us (last on street and nearest tranny) have been experiencing a few trips as well, although they are "council rewired" all on RCBO's...... to be continued!

 

[andrew1210]

Hello Everyone!!!!! I am pleased to report that at the moment, we appear to be SORTED!!!!!!!!

IQA came out this morning, and had a hunch that the RCD, although testing OK, may have been mechanically damaged due to the amount of times it has been tripping.....

So, the pictures should speak for themselves, but two hours later, new split RCD board installed and NO TRIPPING!!!!! and I mean no tripping, not even any nuisance trips caused by any pre-existing problems that were unknown.

So, we've to leave it for a week and see what happens. Heres hoping

So that's a new supply from pole to house, new earth spike and a new CU, all for the cost of £0.00 + VAT

Also notice upgraded tails and Earth cables
And 10/10 for the improvisation on the last CU's grommet!

View media item 37375 View media item 37374 View media item 37373 View media item 37372

 

[andrew1210]

So far so good, first night in at least a year with no trips! (and that is me deliberately trying to switch things on and off every now and again lol)

 

[JohnW2]

IQA came out this morning, and had a hunch that the RCD, although testing OK, may have been mechanically damaged due to the amount of times it has been tripping.....
So, the pictures should speak for themselves, but two hours later, new split RCD board installed and NO TRIPPING!!!!! and I mean no tripping, not even any nuisance trips caused by any pre-existing problems that were unknown.

I'm totally lost. I thought was that, quite apart from your 'local' issue of RCD tripping, the ongoing problem was very substantial currents flowing in the earthing conductors of yours and many other properties. Upgrading your CU and thereby replacing a (possibly) damaged RCD will surely not have made any difference to that. It may have cured your immediate problems (RCD tripping) but I would have thought it left the other, potentially worrying and dangerous, issue still there for you and your neighbours.

Kind Regards, John.