Antifungal Course in bathroom and DPC course , pls help

[platforminc]

Hi Joe,

I can confirm its dry rot, sepals lacrymans. When I took off the vinyl on the floor, I can almost see the joists, the wood seems flaky, loose, moist, holes in it. The dehumidifier, will it be permanent or just left running for a few days.

With the plaster, theres wood in the bathroom, the panels and they have a bit of moisture as well, it has a old wooded cupboard in the bathroom which I will remove as wood and water/high moisture area isn't a good mix.

I can also confirm historical water leak in the bathroom as well, this would have also had a major effect as well. There is also a problem with the rain water roof pipe, this will also be changed as this caused damp problems with the rear room. I will also fit a new fan extractor in the bathroom, maybe 2 even. What do you think ?

Thanks in advance

 

[Joe Malone]

Hi Joe,

I can confirm its dry rot, sepals lacrymans. When I took off the vinyl on the floor, I can almost see the joists, the wood seems flaky, loose, moist, holes in it. The dehumidifier, will it be permanent or just left running for a few days.

With the plaster, theres wood in the bathroom, the panels and they have a bit of moisture as well, it has a old wooded cupboard in the bathroom which I will remove as wood and water/high moisture area isn't a good mix.

I can also confirm historical water leak in the bathroom as well, this would have also had a major effect as well. There is also a problem with the rain water roof pipe, this will also be changed as this caused damp problems with the rear room. I will also fit a new fan extractor in the bathroom, maybe 2 even. What do you think ?

Thanks in advance

Still not convinced that its dry rot, how have you positively confirmed this diagnosis? If you're talking about wood being obviously moist to the touch then sounds more like wet rot. If you can get hold of a moisture meter then check timber moisture content, if its above 35% then it's more likely wet rot and therefore has far less risk of infection than dry rot.

You will need an extractor fan but it would be silly to fit two as they'd just pull against one another and cancel each other out. Even better, fit a single room heat recovery fan if your budget stretches to one (£150-200).

The point in running a dehumidifier is to help bring timber moisture content back down to 20% or less. A drier atmosphere or lower relative humidity will aid the timber and walls in drying out. You could be running this for a few weeks unfortunately but you need to be monitoring timber moisture content to see if its moving in he right direction. Sounds like you've eradicated the source of moisture. So once things are dried out and defective timber and plasterwork replaced then tha is really all you need to do.

 

[pinenot]

You people slay me, after having tried to slate me you've gone on and on and come all the way round to advising, very bl*&dy nearly the identical info I gave him in the first place, peachy.

To yourself platforminc - good idea to fit a new extractor fan. You can hire these dehumidifiers at most tool hire co's in your area, just make sure you don,t run it all night with the windows and door closed (that's another story) and one night for an industrial heater is enough, Oh! and you can also hire these moisture meters from some, not all, but some of the hire co's _ suggest you phone around...pinenot

 

[Joe Malone]

You people slay me, after having tried to slate me you've gone on and on and come all the way round to advising, very bl*&dy nearly the identical info I gave him in the first place, peachy.

You conveniently forget that your advice regarding ventilation and hacking out brickwork, treating with Boron and skipping the DPC etc was focused on the treatment of dry rot. It was a mixture of ill informed and plain bad advice and you are conveniently focussing on the one item that we did agree on, the use of a dehumidifier. So actually it's hardly anywhere near the advice you gave in the first place. You were handing out advice without even asking which floor the bathroom was on, that was 'peachy'.

 

[platforminc]

Hi Joe,

I will get a meter and measure the moisture level, the dry rot comment came from the report that the damp and timber people wrote, they said there was evidence of the sepula thing that i mentioned. I'm only going by what they said and the fact that its not hard to reveal if its true or not, I'm just not an expert and do not have access to the place yet.

I will try take some pictures when I next visit the place.

Many thanks.

So if I read correctly, I need to take the following actions.


I will get a dehumidifier and use it for a day or two, leave the windows open.

Change the wood in the joists, wrap with polythene and just spray the wood with treatment chemical, the type that can be bought from most DIY shops. Just to be 100% safe.

I prefer to use hardie backer boards as they are water proof, so I will have this fitted on top of the joists and then tile. the floor

The damaged areas of plaster will be removed and re-plastered. Are there any additives that can be added to plaster especially when used in high moisture areas, i.e antifungal chemical etc or just normal plaster is good. Any special palster for bathroom.

As for the ramp in the rear room, this was caused by leaking gutter/downpipes by the roof, I will have this changed.

Reading the surveyors report, he mentions something about the brickwork. See the text below.




MAIN WALLS
The walls which are approximately 225mm (9'') thick, are built of brick and are of solid construction. Externally, the front walls are rendered. Internally, the walls have plaster finishes.
As noted in Section E3, the rear walls are damp with soft and defective plaster.
The paper decorations are coming away and in some cases are covered with

The dampness has been made worse by the poor condition of the pointing on the rear wall. There is also loose brickwork in the conservatory near ground level which needs repair.
Once the rainwater goods have been checked and repaired the wall should be
repointed and loose brickwork repaired. There are extensive areas of defective
plaster which need replacement.
The walls are otherwise in satisfactory structural condition with no evidence of
bulging or serious cracks.

The damp-proof course (horizontal damp barrier)
We cannot confirm whether a damp-proof course is present because of the
external render coating and paint finishes obscuring the construction. However,
bearing in mind the age of the property, the walls are likely to have a bitumen feltdamp-proof course, We found no signs of rising dampness in the property and the damp-proof course appears fully effective.



Now what strikes me is that the surveyor doesnt mensiona collapse of the DPC, but the timber and damp people did. So you are right in that when you invite these people, they mention work that may not be required and say things that are designed to scare you.

 

[Joe Malone]

Hi Joe,

I will get a meter and measure the moisture level, the dry rot comment came from the report that the damp and timber people wrote, they said there was evidence of the sepula thing that i mentioned. I'm only going by what they said and the fact that its not hard to reveal if its true or not, I'm just not an expert and do not have access to the place yet.

I will try take some pictures when I next visit the place.

Many thanks.

So if I read correctly, I need to take the following actions.


I will get a dehumidifier and use it for a day or two, leave the windows open.

Change the wood in the joists, wrap with polythene and just spray the wood with treatment chemical, the type that can be bought from most DIY shops. Just to be 100% safe.

I prefer to use hardie backer boards as they are water proof, so I will have this fitted on top of the joists and then tile. the floor

The damaged areas of plaster will be removed and re-plastered. Are there any additives that can be added to plaster especially when used in high moisture areas, i.e antifungal chemical etc or just normal plaster is good. Any special palster for bathroom.

As for the ramp in the rear room, this was caused by leaking gutter/downpipes by the roof, I will have this changed.

Reading the surveyors report, he mentions something about the brickwork. See the text below.




MAIN WALLS
The walls which are approximately 225mm (9'') thick, are built of brick and are of solid construction. Externally, the front walls are rendered. Internally, the walls have plaster finishes.
As noted in Section E3, the rear walls are damp with soft and defective plaster.
The paper decorations are coming away and in some cases are covered with

The dampness has been made worse by the poor condition of the pointing on the rear wall. There is also loose brickwork in the conservatory near ground level which needs repair.
Once the rainwater goods have been checked and repaired the wall should be
repointed and loose brickwork repaired. There are extensive areas of defective
plaster which need replacement.
The walls are otherwise in satisfactory structural condition with no evidence of
bulging or serious cracks.

The damp-proof course (horizontal damp barrier)
We cannot confirm whether a damp-proof course is present because of the
external render coating and paint finishes obscuring the construction. However,
bearing in mind the age of the property, the walls are likely to have a bitumen feltdamp-proof course, We found no signs of rising dampness in the property and the damp-proof course appears fully effective.



Now what strikes me is that the surveyor doesnt mensiona collapse of the DPC, but the timber and damp people did. So you are right in that when you invite these people, they mention work that may not be required and say things that are designed to scare you.

Haven't got time to reply fully at the moment but don't leave the window open when running a dehumidifier because if you do it won't work, effectively you'll be trying to reduce relative humidity in the whole of the UK.

 

[pinenot]

I can't stress enough the effect an industrial dehumidifier running in a small room, like a bathroom, can have. I've seen doors so badly dried out on the inside, but not the opposite side, to imbalance the wind of the door that it buckled when opened, only the close fit round the frame prevented a full curl. Open a hopper (on a casement window) or open to the ventilation stage as your window requires , otherwise you could have problems...I hope someone else can back me up on this, before you make a mistake hear...pinenot

 

[tony1851]

I've seen doors so badly dried out on the inside, but not the opposite side, to imbalance the wind of the door that it buckled when opened, only the close fit round the frame prevented a full curl.

Just can't believe that, pinenot!

 

[Joe Malone]

I've seen doors so badly dried out on the inside, but not the opposite side, to imbalance the wind of the door that it buckled when opened, only the close fit round the frame prevented a full curl.

Just can't believe that, pinenot!

No, neither can I. Suspect you'll be waiting til Doomsday to get backing on that one. Pinenot, do you just make this stuff up in your head?

 

[pinenot]

I've seen doors so badly dried out on the inside, but not the opposite side, to imbalance the wind of the door that it buckled when opened, only the close fit round the frame prevented a full curl.

Just can't believe that, pinenot!

No, neither can I. Suspect you'll be waiting til Doomsday to get backing on that one. Pinenot, do you just make this stuff up in your head?

Unfortunately that's both of you's problem, if if doesn't hit you on the head

Untitled

• pinenot
• 9 May 2013
• 1

ther's no way in, and you simply drop insults on anyone opposing you. you should try listening for once, as we say in Scortland - yer no often right but yer wrang again.

 

[pinenot]

Platforminc; I'm advising this because I have experience of it, the banker!! running this site, allowed the night watchman to close the windows in a bedroom and close the door, it was an industrial dehumidifier, like you'd get from a hire co., and in the morning when I tried to open the door it was jammed in it's frame. I put my shoulder to it and the door was literally curled into the room. Two wardrobe doors were likewise curled and the skirtings and facings were coming off the wall, you have been warned, Oh! and if I remember, it tells you so on the plant hire documents that come with the delivery of the unit...pinenot

 

[tony1851]

Initially I was against Scotland leaving the Union, but now I can see the advantages.

 

[Alastairreid]

Initially I was against Scotland leaving the Union, but now I can see the advantages.

....Refugee status for me!

 

[Joe Malone]

I've seen doors so badly dried out on the inside, but not the opposite side, to imbalance the wind of the door that it buckled when opened, only the close fit round the frame prevented a full curl.

Just can't believe that, pinenot!

No, neither can I. Suspect you'll be waiting til Doomsday to get backing on that one. Pinenot, do you just make this stuff up in your head?

Unfortunately that's both of you's problem, if if doesn't hit you on the head

Untitled

• pinenot
• 9 May 2013
• 1

ther's no way in, and you simply drop insults on anyone opposing you. you should try listening for once, as we say in Scortland - yer no often right but yer wrang again.

No, I've not actually insulted you though I have questioned your ability to hand out advice. You don't oppose me, you oppose the facts, common sense and professional integrity. You have repeatedly failed to answer any question I've asked of you and you're the one that resorts to silly school ground insults. I'm genuinely at a loss to understand where you get the nonsense from that you spout so my asking if you make it up in your head was a serious question and not an insult.
That you now claim that manufacturers instruction for industrial dehumidifier s insert a written caveat that they 'curl doors' is another one of your ridiculous claims. Can I suggest an alternative handle to Pinenot, maybe Pinenut or even Walter Mitty because then at least the potential victims of your advice have a fair crack at understanding your motivation.

 

[Joe Malone]

Hi Joe,

I will get a meter and measure the moisture level, the dry rot comment came from the report that the damp and timber people wrote, they said there was evidence of the sepula thing that i mentioned. I'm only going by what they said and the fact that its not hard to reveal if its true or not, I'm just not an expert and do not have access to the place yet.

I will try take some pictures when I next visit the place.

Many thanks.

So if I read correctly, I need to take the following actions.


I will get a dehumidifier and use it for a day or two, leave the windows open.

Change the wood in the joists, wrap with polythene and just spray the wood with treatment chemical, the type that can be bought from most DIY shops. Just to be 100% safe.

I prefer to use hardie backer boards as they are water proof, so I will have this fitted on top of the joists and then tile. the floor

The damaged areas of plaster will be removed and re-plastered. Are there any additives that can be added to plaster especially when used in high moisture areas, i.e antifungal chemical etc or just normal plaster is good. Any special palster for bathroom.

As for the ramp in the rear room, this was caused by leaking gutter/downpipes by the roof, I will have this changed.

Reading the surveyors report, he mentions something about the brickwork. See the text below.




MAIN WALLS
The walls which are approximately 225mm (9'') thick, are built of brick and are of solid construction. Externally, the front walls are rendered. Internally, the walls have plaster finishes.
As noted in Section E3, the rear walls are damp with soft and defective plaster.
The paper decorations are coming away and in some cases are covered with

The dampness has been made worse by the poor condition of the pointing on the rear wall. There is also loose brickwork in the conservatory near ground level which needs repair.
Once the rainwater goods have been checked and repaired the wall should be
repointed and loose brickwork repaired. There are extensive areas of defective
plaster which need replacement.
The walls are otherwise in satisfactory structural condition with no evidence of
bulging or serious cracks.

The damp-proof course (horizontal damp barrier)
We cannot confirm whether a damp-proof course is present because of the
external render coating and paint finishes obscuring the construction. However,
bearing in mind the age of the property, the walls are likely to have a bitumen feltdamp-proof course, We found no signs of rising dampness in the property and the damp-proof course appears fully effective.



Now what strikes me is that the surveyor doesnt mensiona collapse of the DPC, but the timber and damp people did. So you are right in that when you invite these people, they mention work that may not be required and say things that are designed to scare you.

As previously stated there is no point in running a dehumidifier with the window left open

No point in spraying timbers with preservative, they would have been pressure treated when installed and so long as you get the moisture content down to 20% or below then you won't have any further problems.

Salt retardant additives used to be added to render for damp proofing work before renovating plasters became widely available. As previously stated, use a renovating plaster and this will dam in the damp and give the appearance of a dry wall. Renovating plasters are impermeable to damp whereas traditional plaster is not.

In terms of the surveyors report he is clearly inferring that you had a chronic problem with penetrating damp due to leaky guttering and defective pointing. Attend to both these conditions and have defective plasterwork replaced with renovating plaster.

I have researched rising damp in great detail and read just about every piece of literature going on the subject and there is no proof whatsoever that physical DPC's fail. You should treat any claim with scepticism and they certainly don't 'collapse'. The timber and damp people are in the business of creating work from alleged failed DPC's and the alleged need for a retrofit chemical DPC. The passages quoted from the surveyors report sound perfectly reasonable, the quotes from the timber and damp company sound ridiculous. In any event what testing did they do to reach any of these conclusions? These companies are usually PCA registered and their operatives are generally very badly trained and educated on the subject.
What they say isn't designed to scare you, it's designed to get you to spend your money on unnecessary treaments. Treatment for rising damp should be a small niche industry because its so incredibly rare. You'd not think so judging by the size of the damp proofing industry. There simply isn't enough work to go round so they have to create it.