Domestic to Commercial Gas

[MFairbairn23]

I'm moving from working on domestic gas to commercial stuff, I'm doing the ACS commercial conversion course as well as quite a few other units required my my new job (radiant tubes, first fix pipework, direct and indirect gas appliances etc) in the next couple of weeks.

I've been reading up on commercial stuff but had a few questions I was hoping someone might be able to clear up.

1. Is there anywhere I can get IGE/UP/1A without paying a ridiculous amount of money for it? Could I just get the Corgi Essential Gas Safety Non-Domestic book for the tightness test tables?

2. For vent sizing for flueless heaters e.g. direct warm air and flueless radiant tube/spot heaters would the vent requirement be sized by adding the vent requirement for each flueless heater together as is done in domestic situations?

3. Again for ventilation, how would I calculate the amount of air transfer per hour in a room? I can see how this would be worked out if air was taken in by fanned ducts as the fan would have a m3 per hour rating which could be used to work out the air transfer rate per hour, but what about when there is only natural ventilation in room? Surely you must need to take into account windows/vents/doors to know how frequently the air would change?

I've had a read of the Viper non-domestic book, is the corgi book more detailed?

Thanks.

 

[MFairbairn23]

Thought of another two questions!

4. Is it normal to use a flue-gas analyser on flueless warm air, radiant tube, spot heaters etc in a commercial building?

5. It mentions in the viper book taking a CO2 reading for a flueless radiant tube heater and ensuring levels are less than 2800ppm in the working area would I use a telegan to measure this and would I need an additional qualification to carry this out as for taking ambient CO levels?

Cheers!

 

[gaswizzard]

2. For vent sizing for flueless heaters e.g. direct warm air and flueless radiant tube/spot heaters would the vent requirement be sized by adding the vent requirement for each flueless heater together as is done in domestic situations?

Nooooooooo.
Get over on the CC , it gets too involved for a DIY forum.

 

[MFairbairn23]

I can't mate I don't have my own gas registration to register as a member. I've got ACS CCN1, CPA1, CENWAT but have not been put on the company's registration as I'm transferring over to another division (commercial.)

 

[doitall]

You'll still have a card with your number.

Explain to admin when you apply.

 

[MFairbairn23]

I've got no card so far, would this number be on my ACS certificate?

 

[doitall]

You were registered with the old Company and they should have given you a card, it will have the Company number and your registration number.

 

[MFairbairn23]

Ah rite, no I've never been registered. I've just completed an apprenticeship in heating and vent, sat my ACS at which point the company was going to make me redundant but instead have transferred me into a commercial division and I am to sit the commercial conversion course + additional units and then will be put on their registration.

 

[gaswizzard]

Unless you know the air change rates then thermal evacuation will have to be calculated (evacuation velocity chart) , a good refference source would be R.D.Treloar.

 

[doitall]

Admin will want at least a copy of you ACS.

The information you ask for is available in the CC but it should also be available in you office..

 

[MFairbairn23]

gaswizzard - Thanks. Would BS EN 13410:2001 have this information in aswell? Would you not be able to calculate the air transfer rates from the dimensions/openings for a room? I'll see if I can get hold of that book from a library or something. Does the table provide transfer rates based on dimensions/openings like I am describing?

doitall - Cheers, this is due to arrive in the new few days hopefully so will have to scan it once I do.

 

[gaswizzard]

gaswizzard - Thanks. Would BS EN 13410:2001 have this information in aswell?

I wouldn't know as I don't have them , I would think the latest BS docs would provide you with the ventilation rates for open flued/flueless

Would you not be able to calculate the air transfer rates from the dimensions/openings for a room?

If air change rates are a given then yes , if not then exhaust vent openings will need to be calculated.

Does the table provide transfer rates based on dimensions/openings like I am describing?

Unfortunatey no . it is based on temp/evac velocity rates.

 

[MFairbairn23]

gaswizard - I've found excerpts from Gas Installation Technology by R.D Treloar on google which gives a very good explanation of what I'm asking.

However, if I'm understanding the calculation correctly the calculation asks you to look up on the chart the temperature difference between the inside and outside of the building to give you the evacuation velocity.

I might not be following it correctly but if I am, how can this possibly be used as surely the outside temperature and therefore temperature difference would vary greatly depending on the season/weather.

Am I missing something?

From the excerpts that seems like an excellent book which I think I should try to get a hard copy of.

 

[gaswizzard]

I can't find my copy so bare with me.

Good to see you've found some reference material.

 

[gaswizzard]

However, if I'm understanding the calculation correctly the calculation asks you to look up on the chart the temperature difference between the inside and outside of the building to give you the evacuation velocity.

I might not be following it correctly but if I am, how can this possibly be used as surely the outside temperature and therefore temperature difference would vary greatly depending on the season/weather.

Exactly , the temp difference is referenced with regard to run time , normally we would use 30c , to be safe to be safe.