Energy Performance Certificate. Is it Correct?

[stem]

We're selling mums bungalow and so needed an EPS. It's a small property built in 1980 and each of its 5 heated rooms have a dedicated room thermostat and a 2 port motorised valve to control the radiators therein.

When we received the EPS, the assessor wrote that improvements could be made by installing Thermostatic Radiator Valves. I fail to see how this can make any improvement, especially as each room also has its own boiler interlock through the motorised valve, which standard TRV's don't, and properly located electronic thermostats may even be more accurate than mechanical TRV's positioned in the corners of the room right next to the radiators.

So, I believe the assessor is in error, but before I raise this with him, have I missed something? would there be a fuel saving by taking them out and installing TRV's in their place?

If anyone is curious as to why this system was installed, when the property was built, the room thermostat was located in an internal passage without a radiator, so if the doors to the rest of the property were closed, it didn't sense any change to the temperature and the heating would stay either permanently on, or permanently off.

 

[Terrywookfit]

Are you saying there is a dedicated stat and zone valve for each room ??

The last paragraph is confusing.

 

[stem]

Yes. That is correct. All five rooms have individual thermostats and motorised valves.

 

[Terrywookfit]

The assessor is a fookwit !!
Fitting TRV's would work against what is fitted.

 

[stem]

Thanks for your confirmation! I will contact the assessor for his comments.

The last paragraph is confusing.

Indeed, I omitted to say the original thermostat was removed.

 

[halfway]

Yours is the sort of system we all should strive for.
Ask him to explain how TRVs would improve it. They would interfere with your system if set lowere than your room stat. Your room stat would be calling for heat that it could never get.

Post his answer here and we can scrutinise it. Perhaps also ask for a copy of his credentials.

 

[Jackrae]

Just goes to show that EPC certificates are possibly a total waste of time and money which, at best, are generally based upon subjective assessment by a "jobsworth".

 

[Tay7]

No-one will even look at it.

I wouldn't worry. If someone wants to buy the house they will regardless.

 

[oldbuffer]

I used to do EPC's when they first came in. On average, 30 minutes preparation, 2 hours on site measuring / assessing, another 30 minutes entering the data. Average £110.00 + VAT, so about £35.00 per hour. Reasonable if not generous for London. After a while the prices started to fall, and I've seen people generate and register the certificates in a little under 20 minutes. It can't be done properly in that time, so I stopped doing them.

The certificates are not produced by the assessors, they come off a standardised computer model. This will always put "installation of TRV's would save money / energy" if the box "TRV's yes or no" was marked no. So in your case its not altogether the assessor's fault, its a system flaw.

The original intention was to draw people's attention to the importance of conserving energy. But it was badly implemented, and many of the other measures introduced at the same time have been scrapped. As others have said, no one reads them, and the only time they might make a difference would be if someone was looking at two identical properties and one had a better rating than the other. Pretty unlikely.

 

[stem]

Post his answer here and we can scrutinise it

The answer came from someone in the office, not from the assessor but I have copied it below.

"Further to your e-mail, I have sent this over to the assessor and have just received a response

Unfortunately he cannot recall seeing more than one room thermostat but he cannot confirm that they were not there either, we can therefore return to the property if desired so that he can look at this again for you.

The one concern he has raised is that he could still only enter programmer and at least two room thermostats as it does not appear that time and temperature zone control would be what you currently have set up

We are not sure how much this would affect the EPC and whether the TRV recommendation would drop off with this change.

If you are happy for the assessor to call back to the property, please let me know and we can arrange this for you."

Does anyone understand "The one concern he has raised is that he could still only enter programmer and at least two room thermostats as it does not appear that time and temperature zone control would be what you currently have set up"

Also, seems odd that the assessor missed the thermostats in an empty property with plain walls they aren't exactly hidden. The is also a bank of switches immediately above the programmer, one for each room on / timed / off, all clearly labelled.

I would also have expected the assessor to look in the loft to inspect the insulation, and wondered what the readily visible 5 motorised valves were for. or is that expecting a bit too much?

 

[Jackrae]

Perhaps he'd forgotten his white stick or guide dog in his rush to do a good job.

 

[flameport]

Does anyone understand "The one concern he has raised is that he could still only enter programmer and at least two room thermostats as it does not appear that time and temperature zone control would be what you currently have set up"

It means that the software that creates the EPC has a predefined list of certain types of thermostat and how many there are.
If you have anything other than the half dozen commonly found options, then they can't put that in and the report will therefore not describe what is in the property.
Same applies to all of the other things - even if it was the worlds best energy saving thing, if it's not on the list, it won't be on the report.

This is why new build houses have certain items fitted into them to get A ratings. They are only chosen because they are listed in the software, not because they are actually any good or will save money, be an economic option etc.
It's also why the EPC has suggestions for things which make no sense to anyone - such as paying £4000 to install hot water solar panels to save £25 per year or replacing a perfectly good older gas boiler with a new one to save a few percent on the gas bill.

EPCs are generally useless, and only exist because the law says they have to.

 

[halfway]

Post his answer here and we can scrutinise it

Does anyone understand "The one concern he has raised is that he could still only enter programmer and at least two room thermostats as it does not appear that time and temperature zone control would be what you currently have set up"

Looks like a veiled threat to me. He seems to be suggesting that if you insist on having him come back that you may end up with a poorer rating. Due (as he suggests) to not having time control over each of your stats.

 

[Phill Peck]

Does they guy that installed this setup for you still service the boiler there.
No doubt someone will ask for service record. I'd advise. Getting the guy in for a service and ask him for a brief report explaining that the system is more efficient than the EPC suggests

 

[Dan Robinson]

Jobs for the sake of jobs. But like all these health and safety wombles that are as useful as a chocolate fireguard.