extension being built neighbours boiler flue next to wall

[doitall]

Planning would not be interested in the flue, unless it was brought to their attention at the time, and even then the applicant would have to provide a solution.

I would expect the applicant to approach the neighbour with a cash offer, to re-site the boiler, which would almost certainly mean a new boiler, on the face of it a couple of grand would be money well spent.

Resiting the boiler may be a planning condition, but it would be a Courts decision, and I think you would be in for an expensive surprise.

As I said already.

It may have been an agreement between two people.

New builds, quite often have clauses, covenants etc in the deeds to allow neighbours certain rights, you could find the neighbour has an access right for decorating and maintenance for example.

Are there any windows involved, was the flue legal when it was installed, you know the regs as well as I do Tony.

Hopefully you also know the penalties.

 

[Agile]

As the flue owner did not object to the planning application at the time then he has little hope apart from paying for his flue/boiler to be moved.

Unless there is any legal agreement or consent for the flue, which is very unlikely, then he will have to move it as he never had any consent to discharge across his neighbour's property.

Tony

 

[^woody^]

The flue is not a planning issue, and can not be a consideration in determining a planning application

 

[doitall]

The flue is not a planning issue, and can not be a consideration in determining a planning application

You got that right Woody

 

[mickyg]

there seems to be 2 seperate arguments here.

1 - can you make the neigbour move their flue?

The answer to this depends on factors mentioned by DIA, and can't be answered imo

2- If they ignore your request/order to move the flue, can you just go ahead and build the extension anyway.

The answer to this is clearly no. They may be commiting an offence by not complying to an order etc... but doesn't give anyone the right to make a gas appliance dangerous. Doing this will see the builder in the dock if reported no question.

 

[Onetap]

The neighbours could not have received planning permission to route the flue over an adjoining property. The local authority can't give permission for someone or their flue to trespass on another's property. The applicant also has to sign a statement that they own all the property that is the subject of the planning application.

The question now is whether you can enforce removal of the flue, given that it has been encroaching on your property for 10+ years.

We don't know, we're bleedin plumbers, not lawyers.

However, have a look at the Party Wall Act, here;

http://www.opsi.gov.uk/acts/acts1996/ukpga_19960040_en_1#pb4-l1g10

Look very carefully at section 10, the bit about 'Resolution of Disputes'.

It is very much in your interests to appoint an agreed surveyor, as detailed in section 10,1, a. This involves being nice to the neighbours and arriving at an amicable resolution of your problems.

If you can't agree a resolution, then you're in section 10,1,b territory. That's like Apache territory, only more hostile. 10,1,b is the bit where there's a dispute and "each party shall appoint a surveyor and the two surveyors so appointed shall forthwith select a third surveyor (all of whom are in this section referred to as “the three surveyors”)."

Instead of one surveyor, you'll then have 3 surveyors. You're paying for all 3, by the way. See also 10,2; once appointed and after you serve a Party Wall notice on your neighbour, you can't get rid of whichever 'surveyor' he appoints.

So, as soon as the application goes to the Council, innumerable scum- sucking, low-life, ambulance chasers will be writing to your neighbour, offering to act for him, for free (they charge you). You can't get rid of them (after the Party Wall notice is served). You can't challenge their fees in the County Court. The phrase 'short and curlies' comes to mind. The low life are not surveyors, despite what they call themselves.


So, approach neighbour, be nice, be very nice. Try to appoint an RICS surveyor (invite the neighbour to select one, any one at all). Warn him the low-life will be writing. Then get the RICS agreed surveyor to advise you both. A new boiler at your expense would be cheap compared to the costs a hostile neighbour could cause you.

I am not a lawyer ( I gave that up to become a plumber).

 

[doitall]

That's what I said waaaaaaaay back Onetap

£2K For a nice new boiler for the neighbour and everyone's happy.

Start on solicitors, surveyors, etc, etc, etc, and £2k will be short change, and still no guarantee of getting the job done.

 

[Onetap]

That's what I said waaaaaaaay back Onetap

£2K For a nice new boiler for the neighbour and everyone's happy.

Start on solicitors, surveyors, etc, etc, etc, and £2k will be short change, and still no guarantee of getting the job done.

About the conclusions?
I don't think the details of the Party Wall Act were mentioned, which is the main body of my post.

He has to employ a surveyor or three to comply with the Party Wall Act, so get him/them to advise.

 

[mattylad]

Why does it need to be 2k?

Why can a new vertical flue not be fitted?

Arn't there kits that take it upwards instead?

 

[doitall]

Why does it need to be 2k?

Why can a new vertical flue not be fitted?

Arn't there kits that take it upwards instead?

Lets not forget the age of the boiler for starters, so probably no would be the answer.

 

[BingoBongo]

Why does it need to be 2k?

Why can a new vertical flue not be fitted?

Arn't there kits that take it upwards instead?

Lets not forget the age of the boiler for starters, so probably no would be the answer.

sticky tape and expanding foam should do the trick

 

[Agile]

All, or many, of you are assuming the Party Wall act applies to this situation.

That act is used as "jobs for the boys" and can get very expensive for anyone draw into it so that aspect should be avoided.

The real question is the neighbour has no consent to discharge over your land.

I would start by writing to explain the situation to him, you have PP to build your extension and he is illegally discharging over your property. He has to move his flue!

This sounds like an old natural draught balanced flue so no other modification is possible. Thats well due for renewal! Its new boiler time!

Tony

 

[doitall]

The real question is the neighbour has no consent to discharge over your land.

I would start by writing to explain the situation to him, you have PP to build your extension and he is illegally discharging over your property. He has to move his flue!

Tony

You are assuming they have no consent.

You are assuming they are illegally discharging over the property.

You don't know what rights they have for access to their wall, or even if there's any windows in the wall.

The only way you are likely to get it moved is through the Courts, if they refuse to move it, or simply cannot afford too.

And finally you are assuming they have PP.

Without facts the argument is pointless.

As far as this thread is concerned the only fact is.

They cannot build anything, not even a garden wall, until the boiler issue is resolved.

 

[^woody^]

There is no law to stop the discharging of flue gases over neighbouring land. Otherwise flue gasses would have to go vertically up to the moon.

However if flue gases become a "nuisance" to a neighbouring property, then there will be a potential remedy via the EPA 1990. This can be used to stop the gas becoming a nuisance (ie stop using the flue or otherwise re-direct the flow or reduce the emission) but this legislation can not require the flue to be removed per se

And I am still interested to learn about what legislation will grant a court the authority to force a neighbour to move his flue so that a wall can be built

 

[Agile]

Its up to the neighbour to move their boiler so they can continue to enjoy its safe operation.

The OP can build his extension after giving the neighbour reasonable notice of the proposed work. If the neighbour thought that there was any reason to stop the works then he could then apply to the courts ( but unlikely to succeed in my view although they might grant a stay of execution ).

Tony