External cable

[scousespark]

I'm glad that you are asking, rather than assuming/guessing!

Kind Regards, John

EFLI has indeed asked some questions. Nobody has asked for the load, mentioned RCD and the potential for an external fault to affect internal circuits, asked about earthing. made a rudimentary attempt to design the circuits.
Winston made an assumption that a spur off the DSO will go through an FCU and gets a sarcastic response. On page 1 you said the OP could use larger SWA, but surely that is an assumption.

I can state that the number of domestic installations I have designed without going on-site is zero (apart from college projects).

 

[JohnW2]

On page 1 you said the OP could use larger SWA, but surely that is an assumption.

I would say that it was a statement of fact, rather than an assumption. If you read the whole of my sentence, it is surely obvious that what I was saying was that (particularly if I was about to fork out on expensive landscaping) "I would personally" be inclined to (install a duct or) use cable larger than design would require on the basis of current loads? *** ... and I would say that it is a fact, rather than an assumption, that it is perfectly acceptable to install a cable larger than the minimum size that current design would require - wouldn't you agree?

*** bear in mind that my comment on page 1 to which you refer was a response to our having been told that the electrician had (presumably on the basis of 'design', hopefully based on knowledge of the currently anticipated loads) advised 2.5mm² cable.

Kind Regards, John

 

[ban-all-sheds]

This is ridiculous. Absolutely none of the advice posted in here constitutes design.

I always thought that choosing a cable size was design.

Even if the op follows advice, there would be no legal standing for an EIC written in absentia.

So who would sign the EIC for design?

 

[scousespark]

As you quoted, what I said was about "what I would personally do". Even if you chose to regard that as 'advice', I don't think that anyone could seriously regard "... put in a duct or else use SWA appreciably larger than 2.5mm² " as being meaningful 'design' - so I think that a lot more actual design work would need to be done before the question of any "signing off of a design" arose (and the same goes for BAS's comment about "4-core or 5-core" cable that you have asked the same question about).

Winston posted
3 core SWA. Size depends on loading and length. 2.5mm is probably OK for small power tools and some lights for the avarage garden length.

This resulted in BAS asking the OP to confirm how Winston is going to sign off on design.

You posted
For what it's worth, and particularly since you're about to have landscaping done, I would personally either put in a duct or else use SWA appreciably larger than 2.5mm² - since it's amazing how many people come fairly soon to think of a reason why the need significantly more electricity in their garden/shed/whatever than they originally thought would ever be needed!

This had no reaction from BAS.

Both of the posts are valid and are hardly contentious. Neither of them appear to be design decisions, rather considerations.

More generally, technically speaking, any electrical work should result in a certificate which includes a declaration relating to design - so do I take it that you feel that no-one who comes here and asks for advice about "how to do something" should be answered?

Kind Regards, John

I am not talking about responses, just pointing out that this is an internet forum. The advice given may feed into design, but it would be a massive stretch to say that the advice would be enough to fill in part 1 of an EIC.

 

[JohnW2]

Winston posted ...... This resulted in BAS asking the OP to confirm how Winston is going to sign off on design.
You posted .... This had no reaction from BAS. Both of the posts are valid and are hardly contentious. Neither of them appear to be design decisions, rather considerations.

Quite. However, I didn't realise that you were merely observing that BAS will take every opportunity to criticise or argue with winston, when he wouldn't do the same in response to anyone else (even me!). That is 'old news', and almost a daily occurrence, so we don't really need you to tell us

I am not talking about responses, just pointing out that this is an internet forum. The advice given may feed into design, but it would be a massive stretch to say that the advice would be enough to fill in part 1 of an EIC.

I certainly wouldn't disagree with that, and I doubt whether many others would.

Kind Regards, John

 

[scousespark]

I would say that it was a statement of fact, rather than an assumption. If you read the whole of my sentence, it is surely obvious that what I was saying was that (particularly if I was about to fork out on expensive landscaping) "I would personally" be inclined to (install a duct or) use cable larger than design would require on the basis of current loads? *** ... and I would say that it is a fact, rather than an assumption, that it is perfectly acceptable to install a cable larger than the minimum size that current design would require - wouldn't you agree?

*** bear in mind that my comment on page 1 to which you refer was a response to our having been told that the electrician had (presumably on the basis of 'design', hopefully based on knowledge of the currently anticipated loads) advised 2.5mm² cable.

Kind Regards, John

As this is an internet forum and none of us are on-site, isn't everything we discuss is assumption based? I am always wary when a thread starts with 'I am having work done by an electrician and just want some advice as he is incommunicado (especially when a few minutes later he is replying to texts about the cable size).

 

[scousespark]

I always thought that choosing a cable size was design.



So who would sign the EIC for design?

The cable selection is part of the design process, but Winston did not post a recommendation of cable type or size. He merely posted the type of cable and conductor size suitable for most people with average size gardens and light power usage.

Are you saying you would sign off the design section, based on discussions in a forum?

 

[JohnW2]

As this is an internet forum and none of us are on-site, isn't everything we discuss is assumption based?

A lot of it obviously necessarily is, but facts remain facts, even when they are not dependent upon details of the particular job.

However, I would say that it is a 'fact' (with no 'negative' electrical consequences), rather than an assumption, that, if one is about to have expensive landscaping work, it is worth considering ("...I personally would...") installing an underground cable to an outbuilding which is larger in size than would be the minimum required to satisfy current design considerations (or install a duct)

I would add that, if (presumably with knowledge of the imminent landscaping work) the OP's electrician really did suggest 2.5mm² cable, without any discussion about the possibility/desirability of some 'future proofing', I would question whether that electrician was necessarily thinking about the OP's best interests.

Kind Regards, John

 

[ban-all-sheds]

Winston posted
3 core SWA. Size depends on loading and length. 2.5mm is probably OK for small power tools and some lights for the avarage garden length.

This resulted in BAS asking the OP to confirm how Winston is going to sign off on design.

You posted
For what it's worth, and particularly since you're about to have landscaping done, I would personally either put in a duct or else use SWA appreciably larger than 2.5mm² - since it's amazing how many people come fairly soon to think of a reason why the need significantly more electricity in their garden/shed/whatever than they originally thought would ever be needed!

This had no reaction from BAS.

Both of the posts are valid and are hardly contentious. Neither of them appear to be design decisions, rather considerations.

I can see a qualitative difference between "2.5mm² is probably OK" and "either put in a duct or else use SWA appreciably larger than 2.5mm²".

However, I didn't realise that you were merely observing that BAS will take every opportunity to criticise or argue with winston,

Only when he is wrong. Same as with everybody else.

I leave it to the reader to draw his conclusions if it seems I frequently argue with him.