Ideal E Type RS - H/Water.

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Mid Glamorgan
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Hi All,
Have the above boiler in an open vented system. It is controlled by a Honeywell clock. The hot water is switched to off but the central heating continues to heat the water (really bloody hot).
Is this a clock issue or should I be looking elsewhere?
Thanks
Paul.
 
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had a look and there's no stat on the hot water tank, just an imm heater element.
Does this mean that when I leave the CH running for days on end, I'm also running the HW constantly?
I read somewhere about the Honeywell 'C' plan if this make any sense to separate the two areas.
Hope someone can clarify what's going on.
 
please post a photo of the pipes around your cylinder and boiler, especially around the pump and any motorised valves you have.

When do you think the system was installed?

Is the primary pipe to the cylinder 22mm or 28mm?

is there a valve just visible where the Return pipe exits the cylinder?

Do you like DIY plumbing?
 
Hi John,
Firstly, thanks for the reply - I'll try and put some images up tonight as I'm in work at the moment.
I can't see any valves around the CH tank, just a pipe in at the top (hot) and one going in to the bottom with a tap on it. From memory I'd say that the pipes are 28mm.
This morning, several rads were cold (pump on 3) so I closed the rad off in the spare bedroom and bled off what little air there was in the rads (sometimes it seems like a rad full of air in the bathroom). I switched it all back on and things appeared to be getting warmer but I had to leave for work. (my mrs wanted to kill me as our 8 month old was performing also and I was rattling around the radiators!!!). Also, as I was leaving I notices a small drip from the F&E overflow.
We just bought the house in November and I have no idea when anything was cleaned out etc.
I'm having a running battle trying to balance rads etc. and when I turn the pump up to 3 it seems to draw air into the system. (A heating engineer who services the industrial stuff here where I work said to check the height of the expansion pipe going into the F&E as he said air may pull in through there.) The F&E tank is about 8-10ft above the boiler.
I really don't know where to start other than taking off all the downstairs rads which give me grief and blowing them through with the hose and cleaning the system. I've got a replacement pump (15/50) ready to go as the 15/60 is noisy as hell on 2 & 3 but I'll save that until after cleaning so it doesn't get crudded up.
Any other advice?
PS - Love all DIY apart from papering :0)
 
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Your system sounds quite old and it is open vented. You are also getting gas or air in the radiators. Very likely it has sediment and sludge inside, so it is always worth giving it a clean. Taking off the radiators and squirting them through is a good way to remove a lot of it. To loosen what is in the pipes, you can use a chemical cleaner, such as Sentinel X400 which is very mild, you add it to the F&E and let it circulate for 4 weeks before draining. If you are passing a plumbers merchant or DIY shed today, buy a bottle (it will only cost you about £15).

If you are planning to take the rads off and squirt then through within the next week, do that first. If not, add the chemical and it will loosen the sludge before you squirt it out.

Go into the loft and look at the F&E. It will probably have mud in it. Tie up the ball valve, bale out the mud and sponge it clean, then draw out a bucketful of water from a drain cock downstairs.

Adjust the ball float so there is only a couple of inches depth of water in the F&E above the outlet near the bottom.

Then add the chemical and stir it in as you untie the ball cock. This will draw the chemical down.

Observe the F&E when the pump is running and see if water is coming out of the vent pipe which is curved over the top of the F&E. If so, turn the pump speed down and see if this cures it.

As the X400 starts to work you will find the water in the rads goes jet black, this is with loosened sediment that the chemical is washing round.

It sounds like you have a Gravity Feed to the cylinder. This is inefficient and there are a couple of ways of improving it, which we will discuss after seeing the photos.

Measure the pipes between the boiler and the cylinder (22mm or 28mm) and buy some Climaflex or similar stiff foam pipe lagging. A lot of heat is wasted from these pipes. DIY sheds tend not to carry the 28mm size. Get the thickest that you can fit.

Look for any signs of leaks.
 
Fab stuff John - here's a virtual beer :D
I'll crack on with what you suggest.
Just one more question, should the grundfos 15/60 pump around a 'clean' 10 rad system (ave size rads in rooms) on speed 1 or 2 or will it have to run at 3. The replacement is the 15/50 as a mate got it FOC.
I do think I'll have to adjust the level in the F&E as IIRC there must have been about 8" of water when I went up there and there was sediment in the bottom (hopefully not causing a cold feed blockage which I've read is common).
Just an aside, the F&E is above the kitchen in a 100 year old plus extension to the house which used to be an old coach house (1805/6). When I went up there there were 2 small rooms bright blue walls and coat hooks hanging - also 2 small original windows bricked from the outside and the original lath and plaster work with horse hair!!!!. Amazing what you can find!! Can't wait for replastering in the future to see if the original fireplaces have been covered up.
Many thanks again.
Regards
Paul.
 
I am not a pro, but in my experience, speed 2 is usually enough

As far as I can see, the faster you run it, the noiser the pump and rad valves are, and the more likely an open system is to pump over.

After you have cleaned it, you will need to balance it carefully (if you are going to take all the rads off, that would be a good time to fit TRVs and new lockshields unless you already have newish ones, or Belmonts which can have new seals fitted.
 
Hi John,
If your still available for advice I've put the images in my album which you should be able to view.
Dirty great airlock in system when I came home - just finishing off the balancing act to make sure the important rooms are on.
Cheers.
 
If the boiler is an ideal E type the system is over 30yrs old. Water almost certainly gravity circulation. You can add a motorised valve (motor closed) to change it to a C plan to give HW control.

The system will be full of muck so clean it out as advised above. Also check out the heating FAQ's

Balance the system to a 11deg temp drop across the flow and return. If your radiator pipes are 15mm, without working it out, speed 1 should do fine. If not go to speed 2. The lower speed the better.

Btw keep this boiler until it falls apart.
 
Cheers Tamz for the advice. I've just put a high res image of the inside cover of the boiler in my album (for anyones ref) and if my guess is right the label has the code 9/77 at the bottom - hey jubille year boiler :D
Just got to get the old baby cleaned up a bit methinks.
You say keep it till it fall apart. Is it one of those amazing bits of simple engineering that seem to go on forever as I nearly swapped the lot out for a sealed system just after we bought the house?
Many Thanks
Paul.
 
As you can do basic DIY plumbing, try to gather together £100 to buy a Magnaclean and fit it on a vertical 22mm return piper to the boiler.

I guarantee you will be amazed and delighted to see how much black sludge it collects.

This is as well aas, not instead of, the squirt and chemical work you have planned.
 
Cheers again John,
Going to be a busy and possibly painful sunday job on the rads (if Wales win the rugby!!!) :LOL:
 
Is it one of those amazing bits of simple engineering that seem to go on forever

Yes. Nothing on it to break down. Gas valve, thermostat, thermocouple. Thats it.
Problems may come if burner cracks (although you may find a replacement somewhere) or rusted/rotted flue (inside part, outside is SS).

It may cost about 200 a year more to run but there are a lot of £200's in a new boiler install that costs more to maintain, will, regardless of make, break down at some point and will probably be dead soon after 10 years (if it gets that far).
 

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