Installing new fuseboards and certification

[akist]

Could you please advise me on the process of obtaining a certificate for building control purposes.

I am getting quotes to have new electricity supply and fuseboards installed into the utility room at a new build. I have not yet bought all the light fittings, sockets, switches etc. Kitchen has not been ordered, let alone installed, neither have any of the bathrooms. I have a boiler room where I want to install the boiler to get the house heated up asap, and it requires electricity.

Therefore I envisage that the fuseboards will be installed with a couple of nearby sockets for temporary use (eg the gas boiler) and all other circuits in the house will be left disconnected. In the next few months we will install lights, switches, kitchen, bathrooms etc, but this could take months.

One electrician has suggested he installs the fuseboard and a temporary socket near it, and issue a certificate (which I need for Building Control).

Is that possible / practical? And if it is, will I then get another certificate when we install a few lights here and there, and then maybe another when we install the kitchen or bathrooms? These things will take months.

 

[thomp1983]

A registered spark will do what you pay them to do within reason, they can add and self certify as many circuits as you like at a later date, it's no different to installing a new circuit in any house old or new.

The only consideration to the above is that the board that is fitted is big enough for the future additions.

As for whether you can get a completion certificate based on the above idea will be down to the opinion of your building inspector and you will need to consult with them.

They could for example feel your installing one circuit to get a sign off and will then diy the rest to save money and not have them signed off which their not going to agree with.

 

[akist]

Got you! I definitely need the certificate and I'd rather pay a little bit extra to obtain a few more certificates as we go along, than be left "hanging" for months until the final light bulb gets fitted.

 

[thomp1983]

It wouldn't be 'until the final bulb is fitted' building regs allow anyone to extend an existing circuit so aslong as you have each of the relevant circuits installed in the consumer unit you can extend them all later.

Even in a half built new build I'd imagine it's possible to get at least one socket on each of the socket circuits mounted near there final locations (so one upstairs, one downstairs, one in kitchen, cooker connection point.)

The same goes for the lights get at least one bulb upstairs and downstairs.

 

[akist]

OK, I will make sure we install a few lights and sockets to get going. We are stuck on silly things, colour and type of switches and can't decide. I like very much the Quinetic ones (the idea of controlling a switch from another switch without wiring - and that's how I have wired the house) but they are plastic (not very sleek) and I cannot find matching sockets.

 

[Murdochcat]

OK, I will make sure we install a few lights and sockets to get going. We are stuck on silly things, colour and type of switches and can't decide. I like very much the Quinetic ones (the idea of controlling a switch from another switch without wiring - and that's how I have wired the house) but they are plastic (not very sleek) and I cannot find matching sockets.

I would advise against using wireless switches - I'm in the process of updating a property where there are no hard wired switches and the switches / receivers are faulty / failing - the products are obsolete. This means a room by room update which the homeowner isn't very happy about..........

 

[akist]

I would advise against using wireless switches

Are the ones you are removing accessible or do they have hidden modules in ceiling and in other obscure places? The ones I am proposing are a direct switch replacement, no other parts or modules, or batteries required. They are the Quinetic https://www.tlc-direct.co.uk/Main_Index/Quinetic/index.html#Quinetic_RS

 

[Murdochcat]

Hidden in the ceiling controlling downlighting - hunt the controller gets tedious.

 

[Jon c]

Imo if the property is getting a full refurb/is a new build it's silly to use wireless switches if it's possible to chase walls. However they are great for getting out of an awkward situation if chasing isn't possible and for retrofit work, I've used loads of quinetic gear, never had a problem and I think it's great kit, but wouldn't use it on a full rewire.

 

[ericmark]

I would agree, I have used TP-link with a battery because I have no neutral at switch, but with new build easier to simply run a neutral.

 

[morqthana]

As for whether you can get a completion certificate based on the above idea will be down to the opinion of your building inspector and you will need to consult with them.

They could for example feel your installing one circuit to get a sign off and will then diy the rest to save money and not have them signed off which their not going to agree with.

Seriously?

A building inspector can refuse to sign off all controlled work done, and refuse to accept certifications of controlled work done, because he fears that someone might at a later date carry out more controlled work without seeking approval?

 

[thomp1983]

A building inspector is fully entitled to ensure he's satisfied with the work completed and their signing for.

Do you not think it would raise questions why there's one socket and light bulb in a new build 5 bedroom house for example? They are signing their professional reputation that what is done meets the requirements and is safe.

That said most inspectors are quite pragmatic and will work with you if your open about what your doing and why instead of just trying to get things past them without them noticing.

 

[morqthana]

A building inspector is fully entitled to ensure he's satisfied with the work completed and their signing for.

Indeed.

The work completed.

I question your assertion that he can declare himself unsatisfied with the work completed because he has speculated about future work of which he has no details but has decided he won't like it.

Do you not think it would raise questions why there's one socket and light bulb in a new build 5 bedroom house for example?

It could easily do that. But do any of those questions relate to the quality etc of the installation of the socket and light bulb?

They are signing their professional reputation that what is done meets the requirements and is safe.

I'm pretty sure that not having enough lighting in a house is a problem in its own right and that they don't need to rely on using their predictions of non-compliant work in the future to deny the compliance of work already done?

That said most inspectors are quite pragmatic and will work with you if your open about what your doing and why instead of just trying to get things past them without them noticing.

Are you thinking of Grenfell Tower?

 

[ericmark]

The original question was about certificates, it was nearly a month ago, and it did not really stipulate what certificates, there are five, installation certificate, minor works certificate both can only be signed by person in control, and then there is an EICR which is an inspection after the work is done, all which may be required to get the completion or compliance certificate.

So if using one electrician he could return latter and add to the work or modify the work and issue a new certificate to cover all he has done, but where multi electricians are used, this becomes a problem.

Anyone can issue an EICR but in the main LABC have a list of electricians from whom they will accept an EICR in order to issue an completion certificate, with my late mothers old house we had compliance and completion certificates which were really no more than rubber stamps as there was so little to say who did what and what was covered by each certificate. Much of what I had done was ripped out when house was rewired, but not all, and much of what the kitchen fitters did was redone when rewired, but not all.

I would hope since the 5th December @akist has worked out what he needs. But really the questions need to be directed at his own electrician. And the LABC inspector, they are really the only ones who can answer his questions.

I was really surprised at the difference between Liverpool, Cheshire, and Flintshire. OK Flintshire is Wales, but when doing it rules for England and Wales were the same. Much depends of luck of the draw and what your LABC inspector is like. Flintshire one we got would not accept my sons signature with a C&G 2391 but would take mine with a Fdeng behind my name, seems he had no idea what a C&G 2391 was. I also had a C&G 2391, but it really is luck of the draw over what the LABC will accept.