MCB tripping - double socket fault?

[mbernardh]

MCB for kitchen ring circuit was popping out with increasing frequency.

All appliances test fine.

Suspected one double socket may be at fault. Opened it up - two cables coming in - and found that one of the earth connectors was just loose. Secured this alongside the first into back of socket fascia and when I turn main power back on the MCB pops out immediately with a bit of a flash i.e it trips quicker than ever/immediately.

Ok, I know I should get someone qualified in but am I missing something obvious - does the earth not go in with the other one? Should it be connected to back of the mounting box?

Thanks for any comments

 

[bernardgreen]

I would suspect there is a fault on the cable with that loose earth wire.

Probably a screw or nail has been driven through the cable and shorted the Earth conductor to the Live conductor in the cable at that point. Hence that length of earth wire was Live

While that Live earth conductor was loose in the socket there would not be a short but when you tightened it to the other earth wire there was a short.

 

[BS3036]

Not saying you're wrong Bernard, but that means three faults at once, doesn't it? As it's a ring there would have to be two breaks in the earth (or live), one each side of the point where a nail was driven in. Certainly needs investigating.

 

[mbernardh]

But I'm right that the ends of the two earths should be screwed into the same terminal though?...

 

[RF Lighting]

Yes, definatly.

 

[BS3036]

Didn't notice we had two Bernards.

 

[bernardgreen]

I am beside myself it seems..........


If it is a nail through the cable then it could have cut the Earth conductor in half with only one of the cut ends connected to Live by the nail.

 

[JACKC]

You've hit the nail on the head there Bernard 1 and probably Bernard 2.

 

[ban-all-sheds]

Didn't notice we had two Bernards.

Saints preserve us...

 

[mbernardh]

Nobody's been banging any nails in to the walls for at least the last 5 years.

Realise I'll have to get someone in though.

Thanks for replies though

 

[ebee]

That comment was deeper than some folk think it is.
LOL

Right from now on everbody on this forum is known as Bernard just to avoid any confusion

 

[JohnD]

Bruce.

 

[bernardgreen]

Nobody's been banging any nails in to the walls for at least the last 5 years.

A friend had a "Live" floor board nail for at least ten years before it was found.

Realise I'll have to get someone in though.

It would be the best way to ensure things are repaired and left safe.

 

[ColJack]

odds are that the earth was removed deliberately, and has had the same done the other end..

the offending screw may have been removed but the insulations was damaged and still caused a trip..

 

[mbernardh]

Had the electrician in.

Looks as if earth had just come loose but (as I'd kind of ascertained) that wasn't the problem. Somewhere between this socket and the next the ring was faulty (as others suggested). Electrician couldn't see where cable had beeen compromised though - runs through apparently untouched walls and solid floor.
Interestingly someone had previously bypassed the section before this socket presumably because of a similar problem - taking the ring out and back in the house to avoid ripping out the fitted kitchen/tiling.
Floor may be damp but even so....
Anyway.
Rather than do same again the electricianhas simply broken the ring between the two and, as I understand it I've now got effectively two spurs coming around, one from each side which don't then meet.
This is fine apparently as there are only three sockets running off all this. Fridge, cooker etc on separate ring.

If I ever get kitchen re-done I'll sort if properly.

meanwhile thanks for comments.