Notifiable or not??

[wayneDIY]

Hello Forum...

I am deemed to be a 'competent person' but not a member of a scheme.

Someone has asked me to add some extra sockets to the circuit supplying the kitchen in their shop premises.

Even though it doesn't involve a 'new circuit', the work is still 'notifiable' as it is in a kitchen setting...am I right? However, in the 'Electrician's Guide' to the building regs it says that altering circuits in a kitchen is not notifiable!

If so, building control need informing 7 days before commencement?

If all goes well and they give permission, I can do the work and they will send someone to verify compliance??

On completion, I can then inspect, test and issue a 'Minor Works' certificate?

Can anyone please confirm/correct me on this one?

Many thanks to all,

Wayne..

 

[Taylortwocities]

Electrical work in a kitchen is no longer notifiable, unless you are installing a new circuit.
In fact, the Part P notification business only applies to domestic premises.

 

[EFLImpudence]

No, kitchens themselves are no longer a reason for being notifiable.

 

[JohnW2]

Wot the above two have already said (they typed far faster than I could!)...

... and also ... even if it were domestic, and even if there were a need for notification (which there would have been, in a kitchen, until April 2013), it would almost certainly not have made sense to pay the notification fee (which in some areas can be 'a few hundred pounds') in order to install a few new sockets - far cheaper to employ a self-certifying electrician to do it (at negligible notification cost).

Kind Regards, John

 

[EFLImpudence]

Overlooked the 'shop premises' -

Part P does not apply to commercial premises unless it shares a supply with a dwelling.

Having said that should you, wayneDIY, be doing work in a commercial setting?
Insurance?

 

[ban-all-sheds]

And general knowledge of regulations.

If he doesn't know what the Building Regulations say, I wonder what other regulations he doesn't know?

Plus why would someone competent and insured to do work in a commercial property, with all the liability concerns and H&S laws to consider, call himself "wayneDIY"?

I am deemed to be a 'competent person'

By whom?

 

[wayneDIY]

And general knowledge of regulations.

If he doesn't know what the Building Regulations say, I wonder what other regulations he doesn't know?

Plus why would someone competent and insured to do work in a commercial property, with all the liability concerns and H&S laws to consider, call himself "wayneDIY"?

I am deemed to be a 'competent person'

By whom?

I was just asking for clarification, that's all. I wasn't asking to be treated like an idiot for asking an honest question. As we are all aware, the regs and associated documents can be very contradictory.

Also, I was led to believe that the only dumb question is the one you don't ask!! The name is just a name...what would be more acceptable to you and all the other 'know it all' professionals here??

 

[wayneDIY]

Overlooked the 'shop premises' -

Part P does not apply to commercial premises unless it shares a supply with a dwelling.

Having said that should you, wayneDIY, be doing work in a commercial setting?
Insurance?

Thanks for that advice, very helpful.

 

[wayneDIY]

Wot the above two have already said (they typed far faster than I could!)...

... and also ... even if it were domestic, and even if there were a need for notification (which there would have been, in a kitchen, until April 2013), it would almost certainly not have made sense to pay the notification fee (which in some areas can be 'a few hundred pounds') in order to install a few new sockets - far cheaper to employ a self-certifying electrician to do it (at negligible notification cost).

Kind Regards, John

Thanks for that, John...sound advice.

 

[PrenticeBoyofDerry]

wanyneDIY,
Don't take this the wrong way, generally trying to be helpful and interested in your comments.

if you intend to sell your services as an electrician in the domestic sector, I would recommend you bring your self up to speed with this document.
http://www.planningportal.gov.uk/uploads/br/BR_PDF_AD_P_2013.pdf.

In essence notifiable work only applies to new circuits, a board change or work within the zones of a room containing bath/shower.
I also notify work when changing the characteristic of the board, such as updating MCB protected circuits to those with RCD protection.

With regards to commercial work as already mentioned make sure you have your insurances place, that would also count for domestic work.


And regarding to competence, I would also be interested under what assessment were you deemed to be electrically competent?

A read of this document could be helpful:
Memorandum of guidance on the Electricity at Work Regulations 1989.

 

[wayneDIY]

wanyneDIY,
Don't take this the wrong way, generally trying to be helpful and interested in your comments.

if you intend to sell your services as an electrician in the domestic sector, I would recommend you bring your self up to speed with this document.
http://www.planningportal.gov.uk/uploads/br/BR_PDF_AD_P_2013.pdf.

In essence notifiable work only applies to new circuits, a board change or work within the zones of a room containing bath/shower.
I also notify work when changing the characteristic of the board, such as updating MCB protected circuits to those with RCD protection.

With regards to commercial work as already mentioned make sure you have your insurances place, that would also count for domestic work.


And regarding to competence, I would also be interested under what assessment were you deemed to be electrically competent?

A read of this document could be helpful:
Memorandum of guidance on the Electricity at Work Regulations 1989.

Many thanks for your advice. I have been certificated in the following areas:

(i)Bpec Part P-Defined Scope
(ii)Bpec Part P-Full Scope
(iii)C&G 2382 BS7671, 17th edition- Wiring regs
(iv)C&G 2392 Initial Verification and Testing
(v)C&G 2377 PAT
(vi)C&G 2365 Level 2 Diploma in Electrical Installations

 

[ban-all-sheds]

The name is just a name...what would be more acceptable to you and all the other 'know it all' professionals here??

It's not a question of what's "acceptable". If you come onto a DIY forum (not a professional electrician one) and call yourself something with DIY in your name, it shouldn't be a big surprise if people think you're a DIYer...

And given your qualifications it might have been better to describe yourself as a "qualified electrician" rather than saying "I am deemed to be a 'competent person'".

Because as you can see, there was pretty widespread concern about someone who appeared to be a DIYer with unspecific claims to "competence" and who didn't know what the Building Regulations have said for the last 18 months, doing electrical work in an environment where the EAWR applies, employer liability and public liability insurance policies are in place, etc.

It turns out the concern was misplaced, but hopefully you can see how it arose.

 

[ban-all-sheds]

 

[wayneDIY]

The name is just a name...what would be more acceptable to you and all the other 'know it all' professionals here??

It's not a question of what's "acceptable". If you come onto a DIY forum (not a professional electrician one) and call yourself something with DIY in your name, it shouldn't be a big surprise if people think you're a DIYer...

And given your qualifications it might have been better to describe yourself as a "qualified electrician" rather than saying "I am deemed to be a 'competent person'".

Because as you can see, there was pretty widespread concern about someone who appeared to be a DIYer with unspecific claims to "competence" and who didn't know what the Building Regulations have said for the last 18 months, doing electrical work in an environment where the EAWR applies, employer liability and public liability insurance policies are in place, etc.

It turns out the concern was misplaced, but hopefully you can see how it arose.

Yes, I see your point. However, I have been told many times during training that the title, 'Qualified Electrician' is a bit hazy...but, the title of 'Competent Person' is in line with what is formally stated in BS7671, EWR and HSWA...e.t.c.

The title of WayneDIY...was maybe a poor and misleading choice.

Best regards anyway!!

Wayne

 

[JohnW2]

It's not a question of what's "acceptable". If you come onto a DIY forum (not a professional electrician one) and call yourself something with DIY in your name, it shouldn't be a big surprise if people think you're a DIYer...

No, not a big surprise - we are well used to people jumping to conclusions and 'assuming' (in some cases nearly always 'assuming the worst').

DIYnot is a multidisciplinary site, with only two forums/fora which relate to electricity, yet members have only one username across the whole site. As is the case with many of us, professionals in one field may well be 'DIYers' in other fields - so, if you always assume that to have "DIY" in their username means that they are necessarily a non-professional in the field of a particular forum, you are bound to sometimes make false assumptions.

Given these uncertainties, it probably would have been better if you had simply asked wayne to clarify what he meant by "deemed to be a competent person" before you started making 'accusatory' comments.

Kind Regards, John