Outside Lighting: Possible to have PIR + Timer + Switch

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Hi, I am looking for options for wiring and am keen to have options for my outside lights.

Ideally, 3 linked outside lights would be activated by anyone of:
  • Switch by front door
  • Timer located by side door
  • Security PIR
Is this feasible? How would it be wired?
 
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Yes it's feasible.

Do you want any of them to turn it on and any of the others to turn it off, or do you want the one that turned it on to turn it off?

You could simply have all 3 switch the supply to the lights, however bear in mind that if you turn it on at the front door, you will have to go to the front door to turn it off.
Or get them all wired like a 3 way lighting system (see the wiki) so you can turn them on/off from any point.
https://www.diynot.com/wiki/Electrics:Intermediate

This depends upon what you have available in each switch (i.e. if the pir has a dpdt relay) or you may need to have the pir power a dpdt relay.

Think about how you want it to work though.
When the timer is in "on time" do you want the lights on during this time or to come on by the pir during this time?
Do you want the pir to turn them on at any time?
Do you want the switch by the door to override them all?

Think hard about how you want it to operate - then let us know.
 
Yes it's possible - but how do you envisage these three devices being used together - given that:

1. a switch is on/off, and very likely to be left in one of those positions
2. timers switch things on and off at times previously determined
3. PIRs switch lights on for a short duration in the event movement is detected.
 
Thanks. Good questions! I think I want them to separately switch supply to the lights (I don't mind needing to return to the front door).

Guess I may want an override somewhere otherwise I wouldn't be able to stop the lights being activated by the PIR should I not want them to light up for some reason.

This is how I imagine it working. Lights are on
  • In the early evening (using timer), or
  • At other times via switch, or
  • When PIR detects movement (security)
 
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In the early evening (using timer),
That won't work, since the time for 'early evening' is different for each week of the year.

An override switch as you have described would need to be a 3 position one - on, off, auto. Very likely to be accidentally left in the wrong position so the other devices do not work.

Generally lights are controlled in one of these ways:

1. Switched on and off using a normal switch.
2. Switched on at dusk and off at dawn using a light sensor. Some might have a timer as part of that to switch off say at midnight, but those cost rather more and given the tiny cost of operating LED lights, the savings are effectively zero.
3. Switched on when movement is detected via a PIR or microwave sensor, the majority of which also include a light sensor so they only operate when it's dark.

Timers are a bust, unless you want one of the very expensive types which compensate for the different sunrise and sunset times throughout the year - and a light sensor is alsmost always a far cheaper and easier solution to that.

Lights don't improve security either. They just allow criminals to see what they are doing more easily.
 
I was anticipating adjusting the timer, say, once a month. I would ideally like the lights to be on from dusk(ish) until 9pm. And then later if desired/activated.

(I guess I could put a dusk/dawn in series with the timer).
 
Sangamo do a digital din rail mount timer that tracks the sun and you can set early off as well
 
I've got a bit lost here.
Do you want a time switch, where you set the times for it to go on and off or a timer where you push a button for it to run for a predetermined period of time?
 
My parents got a setup with a wall switch and PIR. I don't know how it's wired but the PIR (German I think) has a special function control by the standard wall light switch:
Switch on= light comes on when PIR detected motion.
Switch off= no light
Switching on, off, on within a few seconds= light permanently on.

(I remember the electrican trying to get this to work with a 2way switch but declaring after 3 hours of trying that this won't work, so this might not be compatible with your timer idea)
 
Yes it's feasible.

Do you want any of them to turn it on and any of the others to turn it off, or do you want the one that turned it on to turn it off?

You could simply have all 3 switch the supply to the lights, however bear in mind that if you turn it on at the front door, you will have to go to the front door to turn it off.
Or get them all wired like a 3 way lighting system (see the wiki) so you can turn them on/off from any point.
https://www.diynot.com/wiki/Electrics:Intermediate

This depends upon what you have available in each switch (i.e. if the pir has a dpdt relay) or you may need to have the pir power a dpdt relay.

Think about how you want it to work though.
When the timer is in "on time" do you want the lights on during this time or to come on by the pir during this time?
Do you want the pir to turn them on at any time?
Do you want the switch by the door to override them all?

Think hard about how you want it to operate - then let us know.
Hello, I know this is an old thread but was interested in how you would’ve solved this? outside lights on a timer up to a set time then on a pir throughout night?

Assuming PIR has lux sensor they’ll be off in day. Need them on up to about 2300 but after this time only activated by PIR?

thanks
 
Today with Smart stuff you can integrate loads, the problem is selecting the product, I am not using a PIR, but do use times and switches.

Using smart bulbs some will turn on a dusk and off at fixed time, then on at fixed time and off at dawn.

Other will slowly dim out, so not plunged into darkness, but some things done by app, and some by the bulb, so hard to work out what will do what.

They can have remote controls, and the remote can be a PIR.

And in the main, turn off and back on and it auto turns on.

I have a zigbee relay, and some bulbs are zigbee, I also have wiz, and TCP, and Energenie smart switches plus Google home and Nest Mini's and never sure if the relay, hub, app, or Nest is doing as asked, or behaving like a mischievous little boy.

And this is the problem, it works, but often not a clue why.
 
OR:

Hello, I know this is an old thread but was interested in how you would’ve solved this? outside lights on a timer up to a set time then on a pir throughout night?

Assuming PIR has lux sensor they’ll be off in day. Need them on up to about 2300 but after this time only activated by PIR?
You simply have a standard PIR light system and then add an override with any old timer - and also a switch if you want.
 

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