Relocating an existing boiler

[donmaico]

what i find odd is that I only live in a small 3 bed chalet bungalow (hardly a hotel or large hose where these dead legs are likely to be found) .

"Servotech,
There can be long runs even in a small property"

The cylinder is situated in an airing cupboard which is in the bathroom which is directly above the kitchen , so its all pretty close.
Also the suggestion on that link is that secondary circuits are best suited to unvented systems not vented ones because in the latter air can get in and so lead to corrosion.

"Servotech,
Ignore what they say because they are trying to sell one of their systems LOL The link I posted was just for reference to help me explain a secondary circuit"

Maybe If I stuck with a vented system I should just have a pump fitted for the HW only. Or were you referirng to an unvented system anyway?

"Servotech
I wouldn't fit a pump on the h/w I can't see anything to gain by it.

I was still keeping things vented/saving you some cash and offering a simple solution to the long draw off time for the hot water at the kitchen".

Installing a simple secondary circuit does sound like an ideal solution to me.[/quote]

I will put your suggestion to our HE and see what he says but it does seem to make sense,Unvented system seems a rather expensive option and apart from utilising mains water pressure and no header tank,I can see the advantage

EDIT - Just read somewhere that whilst the primary circuit is the water that goes from boiler to cylinder and secondary from cylinder to the taps.Are you suggesting I should replace the current secondary circuit i order to get rid of any dead legs that might be in the system and have it all nice and tidy? Thanks

 

[Agile]

We complain to manufacturers about them hawking our customers for boiler servicing work, but those that have a large fully employed staff have to find something for them to gainfully do in the warmer months.

Thats probably worse than it looks!

I received a letter intended for a neighbour saying:-

" the Vaillant boiler you have recently had installed needs annual maintenance. We can offer you an annual service and breakdown insurance for £xx"

Thats part of the disadvantage of manufacturers who have staff engineers!

I also blame those who only do installations as they could not care less about that kind of thing.

Others like me who also do servicing and breakdowns should not support manufacturers who do that kind of thing.

Tony

 

[simond]

Well, just for the record I do like servicing our own installs.

If you give a better service than the manufacturers the customer will use you for servicing, simple.

The people you've got to worry about are the likes of Homeserve offering repairs and servicing deals for £36, not Vaillant et all.

No doubt Homeserve are the ones 'offering' servicing to Gas Safe Reg contractors at £18 a pop.

Never mind, when the punters see what turns up on their doorstep they'll know why it looked too good to be true.

 

[Servotech]

EDIT - Just read somewhere that whilst the primary circuit is the water that goes from boiler to cylinder and secondary from cylinder to the taps.Are you suggesting I should replace the current secondary circuit i order to get rid of any dead legs that might be in the system and have it all nice and tidy? Thanks[/quote]



The pipes that go from the boiler to the cylinder are always called the primary flow and primary return (refer to as on the heating side of the system).
The pipe that goes from the top of cylinder to the hot water taps is called the hot water distribution pipe (If you return the hot water distribution pipe to the cylinder it will become the secondary return and form a secondary circuit which is what I think could be a solution to the ong draw off time at the kitchen)). All this is on what we call the domestic side of the cylinder (the actual water that appears at the taps).

 

[donmaico]

EDIT - Just read somewhere that whilst the primary circuit is the water that goes from boiler to cylinder and secondary from cylinder to the taps.Are you suggesting I should replace the current secondary circuit i order to get rid of any dead legs that might be in the system and have it all nice and tidy? Thanks

The pipes that go from the boiler to the cylinder are always called the primary flow and primary return (refer to as on the heating side of the system).
The pipe that goes from the top of cylinder to the hot water taps is called the hot water distribution pipe (If you return the hot water distribution pipe to the cylinder it will become the secondary return and form a secondary circuit which is what I think could be a solution to the ong draw off time at the kitchen)). All this is on what we call the domestic side of the cylinder (the actual water that appears at the taps).[/quote]

Ok i'll have a word about him about that. I just timed the HW and it takes about 30 seconds to warm up and another 10-15 to get hot.Doesnt seem normal to me .Sort of time my old combi used to take, perhaps longer even.
Can I ask you another question this time about cost of spares and boilers.I was looking at a website that supplies spares for various boilers and was quite amazed at how much they differ according to each make of boiler.I took a diverter valve assembly as an example . A Worcester Bosch one came to about £56 , Alpha ( much cheaper boiler ) about £148. whilst Potterton come to about £112.It seems to me quite a balancing making a cost effective choice,them again it may be that some components are better more reliable and longer lasting.What would you say?I am thinking about when the time comes to replace
sthe Ideal
Cant find the cost of Viessmann parts btw

 

[Servotech]

Like in a lot of things today the exorbriant cost of spare parts when things go wrong is very much a sign of the times.
"It's cheaper to throw it away and buy a new one!" is a phrase that often gets wheeled out these days, which to me seems to go against the current trend of the governments policy of throwing money at almost anything designed to save the planet.
I sense I'm going off topic

Myself I quite like the Baxi range of boilers and you get a 5 year gaurantee with it and they are quite easy to fix.
The time for the hot water to earm up dsen't seem too bad and I'm now not sure if this secondary circuit is going to be worth it.
You could always just run a short SC around the bathroom, which will improve things slightly in the kitchen below.
Servotech,

 

[PEDANTICVINDICTIVEMAN]

Unvented = overlycomplicatedcrap and tankfull of unused hot water every night, put a combi in with a preheat facility ie Ideal logic+, fek me it's only a bungalow, how much hot water for 2 people can you need.

 

[donmaico]

Like in a lot of things today the exorbriant cost of spare parts when things go wrong is very much a sign of the times.
"It's cheaper to throw it away and buy a new one!" is a phrase that often gets wheeled out these days, which to me seems to go against the current trend of the governments policy of throwing money at almost anything designed to save the planet.

I agree .It grieves me thinking I might have ti dump a perfectly functional boiler which would probably give several years more service.If Governments were that concerned about environmental issues they would insisting manufacturers made things that lasted again and one didnt have to throw shedloads of money at to keep working



I sense I'm going off topic

Myself I quite like the Baxi range of boilers and you get a 5 year gaurantee with it and they are quite easy to fix.
The time for the hot water to earm up dsen't seem too bad and I'm now not sure if this secondary circuit is going to be worth it.
You could always just run a short SC around the bathroom, which will improve things slightly in the kitchen below.
Servotech,

I have been recommended various brands like Broag , Viessman and Intergas( apparently a simple but robust boiler ) but something well known and British made like B might make more sense fromm the point of view of spares and service

 

[donmaico]

Unvented = overlycomplicatedcrap and tankfull of unused hot water every night, put a combi in with a preheat facility ie Ideal logic+, fek me it's only a bungalow, how much hot water for 2 people can you need.

if I could be sure it was reliable and I wouldnt have to throw loads of money at to keep it going I might consider a combi. On top of that ideal, apart from the fabled Classic, are renowned for producing very poor boilers

 

[PEDANTICVINDICTIVEMAN]

You'll have to throw money at whatever you fit with todays stuff, with a combi you wont need a G3 ticket and only have one appliance to maintain.

 

[donmaico]

You'll have to throw money at whatever you fit with todays stuff, with a combi you wont need a G3 ticket and only have one appliance to maintain.

so the simpler the boiler the better , hence Intergas which doenst have adiverter valve or a hot water plate heat exchanger