Rising damp does not exist

[KonradFischer]

In which funny world of good guys are you living? Surveyors world-wide like the rising damp and measuring of dampness because this is the best business with poor house owners which you can imagine. Huge billions of money worth - so why bother with opposite point of views. And so lot of not much thinking people - just and also in administration - will follow them. It is not their money they waste in public buildings, its only our tax. And some money will perhaps wander in their purses also. No wonder in mafiotic Germany, perhaps also in other parts of the world.

I restorate old buildings - and very well known monuments like castles, monasteries, churches and townhalls - in Germany since more than 20 years and have learnt from the old craftsmans skills a lot. As I am responsible for my plannings you can imagine that I will not only joke just around. I have cured a lot of suspected 'rising' damp with the most simple means - otherwise I would not lose only a word about it.

Once more: It is no capillary transport between stone pores and mortar pores - try it out with your very special stones and contradict me with a real refutation. Post the foto in this thread - I am excited. Here is another of mine:

(Aufsteigende Feuchtigkeit means rising damp - in spite of not showing some - from a mess installation in Leipzig - thousands have seen it and no one has noticed that there is none)

 

[oilman]

Konrad, thank you for such useful information. We are very lucky to have people like you. I hope you will not get tired of posting here too soon.

 

[joe-90]

I live in an area that is plauged by rising damp. It's all over the place. It's because we are very low down close to the water table in the trent valley and the bricks are very soft and water absorbent. If you splash them with water they just absorb it.

It's not an arguable point. I've seen it - you haven't.

Ask RICS if it exists.


joe

 

[oilman]

You play quite nice guitar music, why don't you stop trying to play this scratchy old record and put something else on?

 

[Softus]

It's not an arguable point.

Notwithstanding the fact that many people, who have lived in this country longer then him, are actually arguing about the "non-arguable" point.

Ask RICS if it exists.

Surveyors world-wide like the rising damp and measuring of dampness because this is the best business with poor house owners which you can imagine. Huge billions of money worth - so why bother with opposite point of views. And so lot of not much thinking people - just and also in administration - will follow them.

What do we want? Konrad! When do we want him? Now!

 

[joe-90]

My house had rising damp. After the damp course was injected it was bone dry in no time.

I'm telling you it exists because I've seen it.

Ask the Royal Institute of Chartered Surveryors.

Are you saying that all of their members are fraudsters and liars or at best don't understand their jobs?

Well are you?



joe

 

[empip]

Very interesting Konrad .... Thanks. (obviously I know very little on this subject, but like to search around for info)

The 'experts' in Venice seem to feel they suffer 'rising damp', I would have thought they, of all people would be pretty clued up... or are they?

How about the accuracy of mortar mixes? I have watched the old shovel method of gauging volumes of sand, cement etc... and wondered at times about the validity of the mix ... Although I just presumed a pretty wide tolerance was allowable in the mix... I am sure I read somewhere that gauging boxes were used, but not sure, seems to make some sense in achieving accuracy.
What about additives like plasticiser .. I gather this creates little air bubbles throughout the mortar? Does that have an effect upon porosity at all? Would the incorrect use of 'Fairy Liquid' have effects other than final strength loss?
All food for thought ..

 

[oilman]

empip, Konrad will have to answer the technical bits, but I understood that the proportions would be worked out for the particular materials used, so the lime would be used in just the right proportion to coat all of the particles used in the "sand" part of the mix. So the shovel method would be far too crude. In my limited experience, things like detergents are not needed in lime mortar mixes, as the lime makes it plastic. It seems that modern quality control causes difficulties with mixes rather than reduce them, for instance, lime made on site (starting with chalk) has very different properties from the industrial products. This meant that the older limes were more flexible and less prone to cracking.

(Time to duck...............)

 

[empip]

edit ... The guage boxes mentioned here ..
http://www.borpin.co.uk/sbfaq/faq51041.htm

 

[oilman]

Ah, that's for cement mortars, I refuse to contemplate the use of cement (except when I have to), I'm only interested in lime mortars.

 

[Freddie]

Oilman he was joking about the Fairy Liquid, it's what cowboys do

 

[oilman]

YEEEEEAAWWWWNNNNNNNNN, it also happens to be one of the questions in the borpin link

 

[empip]

As I related concerning the gauging boxes, I had read the link.
The 'incorrect' use of 'Fairy Liquid' as a plasticiser is, I believe generally known. I did know of that ... Heard tales of wall joints being scraped out with a nail, the mortar being 'dead'.

I have also read that the 'bubbles' formed by the washing up liquid, vary in size and are not distributed uniformly throughout a mix, is that at least one reason for the reduction in 'final strength'?

What mortar mix should I use for pointing?

You should choose a mortar that is more vapour permeable and less dense that the stone or brickwork into which is being put to ensure that it reduces the decay of this stone or brick as much as possible.

If true, how does this affect the likelihood of rising damp occurring .. if it ever does?
Does 'less dense' imply larger 'pores' therefore less chance of 'capillary transport between stone pores and mortar pores' ?
Over a long period, could the pores in most mortars gradually, as in furring arteries, close up near the under brick source, due to inclusions in the water/damp and therefore support further (higher) capillary action? .. In fact slowly give rise to 'rising damp'?
-

 

[KonradFischer]

In a certain way I will say that most experts stop thinking if it hurts the purse. There are very few like Jesus when it comes to this point. I will not make further comments to a such naturally topic.

Belonging mortar questions:

Only a good shaped pure hydratic lime plaster will work well in- and outside of a masonry wall. There are many technical reasons, here are some of them:

1st The thermal expanding of lime mortar and bricks are very even (0,4-0,6 mm/m/100K), cement mortar will expand much more (~ 1,2) than the brick. Result: Cracks of the mortar, mostly seen outside, where is more thermal difference.

2nd The drying out capacity (after Cadlergues) of lime mortar is 0,25, brick 0,28, cement mortar 2,5. Result: The lime mortar will dry out damp ten times quicker than cement mortar. No storeing of water, no mould attack, no algues.

3rd The binding forces by drying out of the fresh mortar is low of lime mortar and very high of cement mortar. Result: No problems of binding from lime mortar on a 'weak' surface like an old wall, jointed normally with lime mortar.

4th The cement mortars have a lot of efflorescent alkalic salt deposits in it, which can make many problems. Only pure hydratic (not hydraulic!) lime mortar has no efflorescent salts in the receipt.

5th Its not a problem by receipting lime mortar by use of 'shovel method'. But it may be a problem to give in modern chemicals of doubtful use. What modern alchemy has found out is often just the opposite what a good work needs. I do prefer traditional methods in this topic too. They are proved for centuries.

6th The pore volume and size can influence the capillary and drying out behaviour of mortars very much. So the walls behind cement mortars will be more damp than behind lime mortar. But rising damp by capillary activity is not possible to a remarkable level with cement render too. The reasons of rising seeming damp you can find in the salts and other natural sources, as mentioned here: Rising damp - the experts fake

If you will know more details to this topic and can understand german, try this:
Masonry - a technical Guide
In english you will find info about mortar problems here:
Problems with lime mortars and others - my RILEM-lecture in the University of Paisley 1999

The problem is, that 'modern' craftsman are not more used to work with pure hydratic lime mortars, so they will recommend other things without respect of technical behaviour. Look for an old fashioned craftsman, there are many also in the UK. Perhaps ask the National Trust or Historic lime center, there they know the good guys (and give them my greetings).

Good luck!

Konrad

 

[empip]

Cheers K.

If you have a moment what is your take on this ... http://www.phys.tue.nl/nfcmr/cmrmain.html from Eindhoven University of Technology, 'Transport in Permeable Media'