Rough install ??

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Birmingham
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Hi all,

Visually the install looks rough but to name few problems I don't no how it's been signed off

The house was rewired 3 years ago and all is ok with this work but a extension has been completed and several new circuits upgraded onto the existing board

* incorrect manufacture breakers on board
* board has been slightly cut to accommodate the incorrect brakers
* no earth sheathing
*light strappers no brown sleeving on live cables indicated blue
*wires behind plasterboArd run diagonally

Am I being picky ?? Or does this contravene bs7671 and the manufactures of the board
 
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I think so , best of all it's a council contractor working for council in a private house ,

The shower keeps tripping out and unable to get the contractor back out so sent my sparky and he said its rough, said it should have a new board or at best facing where it's been cut for Mcb


I need to write a email regarding the install as the contractor shrugged it off, I'm going to have to look in regs book for the correct paragraphs relating to each fault and say it needs a third party inspection
 
Pictures should do it, no earth sleeving is a concern. Any RCd protection in said Dis board? Also how exactly do you know that wires are run diagonally behind plaster boards?
 
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i know as I was there on the first fix . As the gas engineer ( I hold all electrical qualification also but only for surveying)

I am anal when installing but it's evident when workmanship is lacking .
Left exposed cables when stripping out with just the Mcb turned off and I was making them safe .. Needless to say no safe isolation
 
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I have also found that work done for the social services in my mothers house has not complied with regulations. However it is no worse than the existing house. It is a hard call for electricians when to do matching the existing standard is under half the cost to complying with BS7671, there is that tendency to think one is doing some one a favour keeping the price down.

However in real terms what they are doing is under cutting electricians who follow the rules, so work get worse as time goes on until it hits rock bottom. I would have not wired the additions to that standard myself and I did not see why I should allow anyone else to wire to that standard.

But trying to get it put right was a real problem. It was because the council paid for the work, so I could not tell the electrical company what to do, I had to complain to the council, who in turn should tell the electrical company what to do. Now in my case the RCD protection was missing on a new socket fitted, but the job was not to fit a new socket it was to make the door bell mains powered, so at that time putting a sticker on the socket saying door bell only would have made it comply, plus the issue of a minor works. I could not believe it when the electrical firm wanted more money to correct the errors. They had clearly lost money on the job, when the guy quoting had missed the fact it needed a DC power supply not AC and as a result the electrician had spent an hour or two hunting for a DC power supply, so a half hour job had turned into a half day job. The boss was peeved to be losing money and no way was he loosing any more money sending some one back to put on stickers and make out a minor works certificate.

So I can see the problem, if anything like my council it has a policy of three strikes and your out. So often any poor workmanship will result in the firm being taken off the councils books and once that has happened then the firm has no reason to want to correct things.

Theory is the council should return and correct things, but practice is works has been signed off and paid for so no longer interested. They take attitude you got it for free, why are you complaining.
 
The building of houses in 1954 did not have electrical systems considered to be lethally dangerous, however they were not as safe as the electrical system of today. Back just post war when mothers house was built there were no showers, cooking was solid fuel, and the highest power item was the immersion heater. The house was fitted with a socket in every room so 5 sockets on a ring main rather than as with pre-war houses just 2. But it was easy enough to work out where the wires were hidden in the walls, no longer were they run surface.

Even with all the faults it is still not what I would call lethally dangerous. Yes it will not comply with the regulations, but not dangerous just rough unprofessional workmanship from what I am reading.

What I see is as the real problem is adding any extras to a botched up system leaves the person who adds to it part libel if he does not correct the workmanship. Even with just a minor works one is required to test the existing installation to some extent and sign to say it is OK.

In my younger years I have been caught out. I am sure many have done the same, phone call from boss go to this address you need to do some work not quite sure what is required. On arrival you find you need some small item and you decide since so late you will leave the work not quite right and return next day with parts, but next day your told forget that job this new job is more important. Are you going to tell boss you have left the job non compliant, no you think I will be back in the area soon I will do it then.

In the days when it was rare to complete even installation certificates never mind minor works in two months time no one would remember who did the job anyway. And you would swear blind it was not like that when you left it. OK today we are more careful and if you find you have run out of earth sleeve you will strip some flex rather than leave it. But there are still a few of the old school still around.

So it is that sharp intake of breath and comment jobs worth, and walk off without doing the job, or correct some one else's work. That's the real problem. This tread shows the problem as soon as you touch it you own it, and you can't report poor workmanship that has to be done by the person who ordered the work.

So in this case the council would have to get involved. You as a tradesman tell the owner to tell the council who in turn need to tell the contractor to return and correct the work. Now some one on the council will have signed off the work as completed to his satisfaction, likely he would have asked the house owner if it was all done OK and knowing no better they have said yes. So this council guy will need to tell his boss he did not visit and check the work, or the errors could not be seen. Hacking away at a consumer unit is not really hidden faults, so some one will need to hold up his hand and say sorry sir I did not do my job.

In a perfect world the council will have got the installation certificates or minor works certificates and passed on copies to the home owner, I found out the council social services personnel did not even know there was such a thing as a minor works certificate and so there was no chance of really getting it put right unless I paid for the work.

So in the real world what are you going to do, sharp intake of breath and walk away from the job, or do ones best without causing high expense. If the latter then as link shows the people before you have now got away with it.
 
With the diagonal wiring, how deep are the studs that the plasterboard is fixed to? (if the cable is more than 50mm below the surface then safe zones do not have to be adhered to).
 
The Telegraph said:
Huddersfield-based builders who installed the kitchen in 1999 had broken a string of safety guidelines issued by the Institute of Electrical Engineers. The electric cable, which led from a fuse box to the extractor fan hood above the cooker, was not insulated and was only 10mm deep in the wall instead of the recommended 50mm.
When we read non technical reports we see statements which are clearly incorrect, the rules in 1999 did not require cables to be 50mm deep. Yes they should not "meandered across the wall instead of running in strict horizontal or vertical lines" but we really have no idea to the extent of the meander and as with the Emma Shaw case it was not just the electrician who got it wrong in that case plumbers and plasters also had a part to play.
With the Thirza Whittall case the first reports stated how the new tenants had complained about the electrics and the landlord had engaged an electrician to check it all out, but the accident happened before he arrived. Some of the reports at the time said the faulty heater was the tenants. There are clearly some errors and over stating to the way the cases are reported. Watch builders from hell or what ever it is called and they really go OTT saying how it does not comply, bad yes but not as bad as they make out.

My house the cables do run strict horizontal or vertical lines and I still sawed through one going horizontal which I had not expected a horizontal cable to go between the two way light switches. So keeping to strict horizontal or vertical lines does not work either, we all know we should use a detector first and we are lazy and don't use it. Can't really blame anyone else it was my fault I did not check first.
 

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