Soldering/Welding split lead valleys?

[decentlandlord]

Hi all, after the recent storms (Waterloo, Merseyside) I've got a water ingress problem in the communal area of a Gr 2 listed block of 6 I manage as a leaseholder/director.

I'm ill at present so haven't been able to get up to have a look so a leaseholder has done so with someone he uses on other properties (He hasn't told me who-yet).

The alleged roofer says:

2 ½ coping stones off
4-5 slates cracked
1 slate slipped
A few ridge tiles need re-pointing
The lead in valley has split above where roof was leaking – needs to be welded/soldered

The quote is £140 for sorting the lot out Mon / Tue next week or earlier if he has time due to other jobs finishing earlier.

Couple of basics-
1) Can lead be repaired in this way in this situation?

2) If so are we talking a temporary job until a new code 4 valley is done?

3) Is the quote realistic?

I've left the insurance issues out for brevity, but as a management company we can't use any uninsured 'roofer' anyway.

Many thanks
DL

 

[shan Fr]

If you let him weld the split make shore that you have the fire departments phone number to hand !And that he waits around for at lest an hour to make shore that he did not catch light to the valley boards .
The best way is to cut the lead and insert a new piece the width of the valley ,up under the split and past the split 150mm and down over the split by 150mm.
If the lead is splitting it tends to mean that it can not move with contraction and expansion and weld will only hold as long as the lead is stable or the lead has worn thin.
And I would bet my house on it that he will not weld it ,for £140 he sounds like he is a mastic man uninsured .
All the best

 

[Nige F]

indeed it can be done like this , I`ve done it myself ....but with a mate firewatching inside with an extinguisher sounds like yet another roofing chancer to me ....I just love "roofers" but usually they are rip off with high prices..............it may just be a movement split in the lead or maybe it`s perished .......only a competent leadworking plumber/ roofer can tell by looking ........valley or tapered gutter often confused.......tapered gutter morelikely...one you can walk on between 2 pitches

 

[decentlandlord]

Hi again, many thanks for getting back so quickly and confirming my own suspicions.

I've now organised some pics online so I hopefully can add them for clarity.

(These are earlier reference pics, I haven't yet seen the damage myself)

G25 is a 3 way valley showing the roof over the communal area on the left, under which the water is manifesting and the valley? Tapered gutter? in the pic is therefore where I'm assuming the split is.

G24 is the other direction to the right.
G26 is the overall roof taken from the Mansard at the front, and I suspect that skirt is wrong?

ATa is the roof as a whole

Regards
DL

http://photos.orange.co.uk/album/album_photo.html?c_photo=1063932067

http://photos.orange.co.uk/album/album_photo.html?c_photo=1063932064

http://photos.orange.co.uk/album/album_photo.html?c_photo=1063932061[/img]

http://photos.orange.co.uk/album/album_photo.html?c_photo=1063918586

 

[decentlandlord]

Think I'm getting the hang of this now...

The previous links won't let you expand the pics apparently so here's the link to the full album if you want to see the pics full size.

http://photos.orange.co.uk/album/4874392

Cheers
DL

 

[mnb]

the prices quoted are ridiculous. Dont go near this man. The boxed gutter will probably require stripping out and relaid to watertight falls - quality work that must be done right, it will require disturbing the slate courses on either side. Plus damage to the wood carcassing might be revealed.
The roofs are delapadated and probably require stripping and re-roofing various local repairs have been done in the past. Bite the bullet and scaff up and strip off - the cost? well into the thousands.

 

[shan Fr]

Sadly for you it looks like the roof has had to many £140 repairs done to it
You need to get quotes from two or three reputable roofing contractors
But be prepared , it may not be what you wont to hear
You can only make so many temporary repairs before its time to spend some money and not have to worry about it again

 

[frank999]

Hi,
I understand that to weld sheet lead (for roofing) you ideally need a
oxy acetylene torch with a size 2 nozzle. Can you use a Propane gas torch with a 10mm nozzle to weld lead, or is it too blunt an instrument ?
Thanks

 

[KenGMac]

decentlandlord, hi.

As for the cracked Valley gutter, have a look for replacement fibre glass valley gutters.

These units slip up the valley on top of the Lead and provide a watertight, if you will I suppose replacement that does away with any repairs to the original lead.

As an aside and has been posted above, using an oxy burner, on a roof is a seriously dodgy enterprise.

Ken

 

[ree]

FWIW:
the original posts were from 2007

Frank999, you obviously have limited knowledge of lead burning - so dont even attempt it. Far too many things to go wrong, not least being your safety.
If, possible, get a pro to knock up what you want on the deck not on a roof.

If lead sheet, eg on a valley, has cracked, its usually cracked because its been fixed too long, ie over 1500mm, or its been fixed without leaving room for expansion.
Lead burning the cracks, or burning on a patch, will do nothing but prepare it for cracking again.

 

[frank999]

Thanks for the reply, assuming I had acquired the right skills/experience to work with lead, could you weld lead with a 10mm Propane Gas Torch ?, or do you require an oxy acetylene torch.

Thanks

 

[cotswoldbuilders]

There is a Pencil burner, make is Siever which is smaller than 10mm, I have lead burnt with them, but only on the bench, upright burning near on impossible.

You can get a small set of bottles from most plumbers merchants, about £80

 

[frank999]

Thanks, found these - is this what you mean or is it a hand held torch with the bottle attached:

http://www.gasproducts.co.uk/acatalog/Sievert_3537_Jewellers_Gas_Blow_Torch_Burner_8mm_diameter.html

and

http://www.gasproducts.co.uk/acatalog/Sievert_8842_Needlepoint_Burner_8mm.html

8mm, but not sure if they are for Propane.

Thanks

 

[cotswoldbuilders]

Yes, those are for propane bottles.

But you will struggle with that set up, probably end up burning holes in the lead.

What you need is; Turbo Set 90
You should be able to google it, much finer torch.

 

[KenGMac]

decentlandlord,frank999 hi again.

As a previous post, have a look @ fiberglass valley gutter inserts on Google.

It could be that this form of repair is more effective that an attempt at lead burning?