Stumped by wires for ceiling light fitting.

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There are two wires that come from the ceiling, one copperish in colour and one grey, inside the grey one is a red and black wire. The copper wire is just a wire. these 3 wires went into the old rose, to which we attached the blub. I think I need to figure out which is live , earth and neutral. On the new light fitting there are 3 wires, standard. l.n.e. It's a case of what to attach to what. black n red appear to be live!

This is from the other thread I launched, sorry for any confusion.
All help will be welcome.
 
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