Thoughts on prices at Travis Perkins

[cam123]

And just to respond to nosealls "convoluted and over complicated" point. I don't understand why you'd think that (or why you'd assume i didn't draw up a specification either?).

I agree that i maybe stick my nose into the process rather alot if that is what you suspect? This is due to having had tradesmen who have come highly recommended do some shoddy old work/need to charge extra for things that were obvious at the start/talk absolute b0 llocks at me etc etc etc.

I am actually trying in every way i can think of to stop builders treating me like a f ing idiot - hence my spending most nights this week on this forum!

I am not trying to do a man out of a good living nor are my expectations anything out of the ordinary.

 

[noseall]

A spec' (plan) will determine or outline the parameters.

He quotes for the work detailed in the drawing - when happy with the product, you pay the fee.

If bad luck has befallen you then i am sympathetic. It is a buyers market out there, you need to be patient.

 

[freddiemercurystwin]

I am actually trying in every way i can think of to stop builders treating me like a f ing idiot

Should've got it written down before he started then! Tis too late now.

 

[cam123]

To be honest it didn't occur to me that it would be necessary to get his estimated materials cost in writing as i wouldn't surely under normal circs expect my builder to indemnify against over spend?

Is this how i should do it next time around?

 

[Thermo]

Tp threw their hat in with the big site builders etc and didnt give a stuff about smaller builders in terms of customer care or prices. I stopped using them and went to a local independent who is part of the national buying group. TP cant get anyware near their prices. I got fed up with having a trade account with listed prices on, and then people at the counter putting through wahtever they felt fit. Last straw was when the invoice for a roll of code 4 lead came in at £110 exc vat. Funnily enough they keep phoning me now trying to get my custom back.

They wonder why they are struggling when they treated people like that

 

[freddiemercurystwin]

To be honest it didn't occur to me that it would be necessary to get his estimated materials cost in writing as i wouldn't surely under normal circs expect my builder to indemnify against over spend?

Is this how i should do it next time around?

You wouldn't get a quote for geting work done on your car without finding out how much the parts were and how much the labour was? Or would you?

 

[dextrous]

TP are a rip off and I'm surprised he uses or even recommends them.

To save yourself further over-expense, get a list of materials required and shop around yourself. Any big stuff will need delivering, which has it's own cost, but plenty of little things can be got in the back of a car.

For such a small project, and given that you're providing the fixtures, I'd be surprised at spending over £600 tops for materials including pipework, timber, door, plasterboard, multifinish, cable, insulation etc (apart from adhesive and tiles). Think he's having a laugh!

 

[cam123]

As i've said, i did get the labour cost in writing and have all work itemised.

I did take on the "risk" of covering the cost of materials because i thought that my builder would tell me how much he really thought the materials would be. He has so little to gain by doing this - no financial gain at all, so it didn't occur to me that this would happen.

In future i will insist on having the materials included in the price. This i tend to think would simply have builders add on a chunk of mark up however. Seems like a lose lose situation?

Thanks for that estimate - that is very interesting indeed. Is there not anyone who thinks that TP may not be too bad once discounts are included?!

 

[Richard C]

In future i will insist on having the materials included in the price. This i tend to think would simply have builders add on a chunk of mark up however. Seems like a lose lose situation?

Always get quotes (not estimates, they are legally worthless) in writing & ask for list of materials to be included (itemised as far as possible), get them to include earliest possible start dates & how long it’s going to take to finish & make the quote part of the contract.

Is there not anyone who thinks that TP may not be too bad once discounts are included?!

Not when they give you a 60% discount & it’s still twice the price you can get it for elsewhere, no!

 

[wavetrain]

cam can you give a few examples of TPs prices that you found the most shocking?

I have found TP's redwood to be good quailty, at least the pieces I selected. Selco's on the other hand just warps once you leave their shed if it not already warped.

Taking electrial items as another exmple to Screwfix, unless you are comparing a decent brand, the comparoson is invalid, screwfix sell poor quailty no brand electricals, but we do love their screws don't we?

 

[Richard C]

cam can you give a few examples of TPs prices that you found the most shocking?

Not specifically itemised but several of us already have above I don’t buy much Redwood, is it a large market Screwfix do sell cheapo make electrics, plumbing supplies & most other stuff but they also sell the branded ranges as well if you want it. Plumbing pipe & fittings I’m not so fussed about but I only ever use MK electrical (& they aren’t what they used to be either!) but I don’t usually get them from Screwfix as even they are still more expensive than elsewhere; & I never get my screws from Screwfix!

 

[jeds]

Oh yeah, and i'm the moron as the customer who has to cover the cost of these materials!

Builder says that non average his discount over all products is about 15% but i'm still thinking that it's expensive even with those reductions.

Any one else? The more thoughts the better!

Your man may not be telling the whole truth? I've been using a friendly contractors TP account to purchase materials for a major loft conversion and extension. The discounts are in the range of 45% to 65% - otherwise they would be ludicrously expensive. I suppose it depends on the purchasing power of the contractor though.

 

[wavetrain]

Just found out that Wickes has been owned by TP since 2005

 

[chappers]

The thing is you should either of shopped around for a fixed price quote including materials (and yes there would have been some mark up to cover unforseen materials and sundries).

If you can find a builder who will work on a labour only basis then spend time running around getting materials for you, then expect him to go for the convienient option the other option is to ask for a list of materials required and then source them all yourself, but be prepared, when at two o'clock in the afternoon he says i need you to get me anothe couple of lenghths of timber.

You talk about a lose/lose situation but it seems that you also want the best of both worlds.

I have said this on here in the past but labour only jobs with the client supplying materials rarely works out

 

[TRUSTME]

The answer to this building trade problem of overpricing by builders merchants is to shop around and treat all builders merchants as on the take.

The problem you have with shopping around is dealing with Smart-Alec builders merchants salesmen who can be so convincing: When you do so bear in mind they are often on a small basic + commission and get double-the-normal-rate-of- commission-by overcharging you. These salesmen often have four price structures for the same item and heaven forbid you should be a small client wanting just a few rolls of something.

In the background you then have a large number of brand name manufacturers organising price cartels amongst themselves - evidenced by firms in a particular industry having virtually identical to prices to each other. Builders Merchants classify their clients as shrewd and intelligent, or gullible fools, shmucks and in the USA as 'Elmar'. They know who to overcharge and who not to. Remember there are 4 prices for everything and if you deduct 40% / 45% from the top price quoted you can work backwards to discover what the correct price is or should be. One famous firm from Sheffield can beat Travis-Perkins on overcharging and it's a pity because they turn small clients away by doing so. Big clients love them for the incredible deals they can produce if your on their Magic List.

USA: Elmar was the tall, red headed lanky kid in cowboys films and country bumpkin films who talked slow and with a drawl, he was famous for a while as the sales person favourite customer hence the expression an Elmar walked in and bought it.