Why do plumbers rate Worcester Bosch when Which doesn't?

[bengasman]

Which tests have several flaws.
The biggest is probably that the most important single issue to the consumer is: will my boiler work when I need it? This for a very large part determined by the quality of the installer, possibly the number 1 factor
You can not test this, other than hang a sufficiently large number on walls and see how many break down over 10 years.
Another flaw is that they compare things like efficiency to 0.1% accurate under laboratory conditions. This comparable to the mileage figures for cars; you never get what it says in the brochure, so who cares whether it is 89.8 or 90.3?
Comparing how many kilowatts you get for your money spent is also rather pointless.

 

[kevplumb]

Comparing how many kilowatts you get for your money spent is also rather pointless.

but is it 98.9 pointless or 99.8

 

[bengasman]

but is it 98.9 pointless or 99.8

I would round it off to 100%.
Should that not be "rounding up"

 

[Gasguru]

Customer service is the best in the business though and so is their Techline.

I would fit a CDi in my own home without question,very good boiler IMO.

No it isn't ...... I recently spoke to their tech line, 4 of their staff didn't even understand the FGA procedure on the CDIs (the MI is wrong). None of them have a clue about the technical aspects of this model (being an imported Junkers). Spares backup is generally good but the boilers are £200 - £400 overpriced for what they are. A massive advertising budget and backhanders to installers have put the make at the forefront (undeserved) of the industry.

Just look at the hydraulics....laughable, those dripping PRV's are going to cost owners £££££££££. Worcester haven't made a decent boiler for years....most of it is just bought in plastic carp from Grundfoss.

 

[bengasman]

I recently spoke to their tech line, 4 of their staff didn't even understand the FGA procedure on the CDIs (the MI is wrong). ....

Interesting info. Where is the manual wrong, and what should I do in stead?
I have to admit that my experience with analysers does not go much further than: poke probe in hole and press button.

 

[tonybhoy]

All subjective of course but from my own experience customer service is excellent and the techline is too and of course they answer the phone within two rings.

Some other manufacturer's techline&customer support is appalling ,twenty mins hanging on the phone is not unusual for Vokera for example.

Your correct about the MIs though, I've found at least two mistakes recently ,one was to do with flue lengths on the 42 CDi combi and the other was no information regarding settoing the flow rate through an automatic bypass on a 37 Cdi. That query had to go 'up the line' to a senior tech.

Yes the boilers are overpriced if you are only comparing boiler against boiler but you really do have to take the CS/TH into consideration and that is worth the extra IMO.

Tony.

 

[PeterRayner]

Just to say - I have had the same experience! Plumbers so aggressive to make me get a Worcester Boiler - I felt very suspicious! I came to the conclusion not all plumbers know about every boiler or how to fit them. The Worcester training course for plumbers seems promoted on their web site. I think a lot of plumbers take this course and then don't know how to fit other boilers! Or am I mistaken?!

 

[davebgas]

I hate WB's.

Pigs to work on, what clown put that divertor where it is on the CDi!!!! PRV on new greenstars is in a right retarded place.... Older models are just pap, honestly, rather have a Baxi, Vaillant etc.... I don't rate WB's at all.

But everyone has their own opinion

 

[tonybhoy]

JThe Worcester training course for plumbers seems promoted on their web site. I think a lot of plumbers take this course and then don't know how to fit other boilers! Or am I mistaken?!

Yes your mistaken. There is really no difference at all when fitting other (combi) boilers ,only difference with WB ,in my experience having been on the course, is that they emphasise the importance of correct sizing of the gas supply.

Instructor on my course said that WB get loads of problems with incorrect gas pipes causing nuisance lock outs on the boiler when another appliance is on,hob for example or fire.

They also make a big thing about the flues.

But really all boilers should be installed the same. I was on a main boilers course on monday which was excellent. Instructor on that course stripped the entire boiler down and explained every main part and it's operation, I was really impressed but not enough however to purchase main boilers

 

[WSPH]

what ever boiler you decide to go with, make sure your installer puts in a Y strainer on the return with lever valves(cheaper option) or a boiler buddy/Magnaclean (expensive option).

 

[Agile]

what ever boiler you decide to go with, make sure your installer puts in a Y strainer on the return with lever valves(cheaper option) or a boiler buddy/Magnaclean (expensive option).

Do you mean that he should only do that rather than power flushing for 3-5 hours using X800 ?

 

[kevindgas]

Do you mean that he should only do that rather than power flushing for 3-5 hours using X800 ?

no, in addition as it stops a load of crud getting into boiler when rads fail

 

[kevplumb]

where is the standard for "powerflushing" in any MI's

 

[WSPH]

Do you mean that he should only do that rather than power flushing for 3-5 hours using X800 ?

you never know what installer he'll come across. we usually use the existing boiler if still functional to power flush the system with heat, otherwise we have immersioned power flush units but they take quite some time to heat it up. + what kevin said

where is the standard for "powerflushing" in any MI's

Its usually in the benchmark section where it asks you what type of product you used to clean the system. (last few pages, if your familiar with it

 

[jennymole]

Wow I had no idea my novice post would generate so much discussion - and much of it is way over to my non technical head! However, to sum up this is what I feel I've learned so far:
the "which" testing is flawed
don't trust the "boiler of the year" award
getting the boiler installed well is as important as the make of the boiler

some people rate Worcester Bosch some people feel they are very over rated

likewise some people rate their tech line some people feel the opposite

Worcester Boschs can be tricky to fit and there may be "giveaways" to installers making them more likely to recommend them.

Valliant have a good reputation

Bearing all this in mind, as well as the fact lack of space is a major issue
I'm thinking about a "Worcester Greenstar 24i Junior" (recommended by the potential installer) or a "Vaillant ecoTEC plus 824" (my idea based on Valliants good reputation).
Any opinions on these particular models or on a recommendation of a better one would be really, really appreciated.