A
ALEC1
i think thats right, we should be installing heating systems that can be as efficient as possible... the rest is up to the user...
Would leaving boiler on all day increase bill?
- Thread starter filthyturk
- Start date
i think thats right, we should be installing heating systems that can be as efficient as possible... the rest is up to the user...
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eehh have you tried shopping around
i pay 3.4p per kw for gas and 10.8p per kw electric before discounts
Does that include VAT?
Do you have a standing charge?
Who is that with?
Tony
scottish power on line energy 17 i think it is[yep checked it is]
you can get it with or without standing charge makes little difference as they load up the first x amount off units
yes includes vat but as vat is only 5% on gas or electric makes little difference
http://www.scottishpower.co.uk/PDF/L201202_OnlineEnergySaver17.pdf
but off course thats no the whole story i may be paying more than you for the standing charge or equivilent you need to compare
eehh have you tried shopping around
i pay 3.4p per kw for gas and 10.8p per kw electric before discounts
that is a very good price, you might care to tell me either here or send a message and who by?
my exact price is 3.552p and electric is 11.66p excluding vat 5%
sends you my thanks!
as per my previous post
Thanks for that. But its a bit misleading to just quote a marginal rate.
The actual average annual rate can vary widely. In fact an efficient system would be only paying the initial loaded rate for at least two quarters.
Tony
The actual average annual rate can vary widely. In fact an efficient system would be only paying the initial loaded rate for at least two quarters.
Tony
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On average we are paying around £20 a month in equivalent standing charges for dual fuel, or £10 per fuel,
This is equivalent of paying 12 months x £20 = £240 before you could even use an ounce of energy!
Think of it as nice Mobile phone contarct, and you can have 5000 free minutes to any network of tak=lk time and you get one of the modern phones!
or think of it as a lower priced Lap top, or think of it as a TV Licence fee to watch TV,
Or even think how much this £240.00 can off set your council tax or your house insurance, or even your car insurance!
many of us don't even think of it as a standing charge being levied indirectly, as most of the consumers were fooled by energy companies who very proudly announced that they have removed all standing charges for their customers.....hold on a minute.....what a pack of lies.........so why have they then formed a tier system of pricing, where customers are charges quite a lot more for their first tier, and only after that the price becomes what it should have been in the first place.
Oh wait a minute.....its for infra structure ! for laying pipelines, for transporting energy, for the metering, oh yes....go on.....
I was goingto really moan about this with eon, my energy supplier, as I remember their representatives knocked on my door and asked me to sign up a contarct with them as they do not have stsnding charge!
the only thing that stopped me from complaining was the fcat they gave me 10% discount on gas and 6% on electricity. Which actually cancelled the equivalent standing charge.
So how come petrol garages don't charge their customers (drivers) two tier system for delivering fuel? they have to own forecourts, install pumps, employ till staff, pay for council tax for the premises, rents, maintenec, deliveries, and so how come they have one single rate or a single tier for fuel and so why should gas and electricity be qny different, end of the day it is still the energy just as much as petrol is.
I think there should be one single energy tier rate, and just as motorist have a choice which garage to fill their tanks from, like wise consumers should be able to choose from which supplier he wants his energy billed by.
This is equivalent of paying 12 months x £20 = £240 before you could even use an ounce of energy!
Think of it as nice Mobile phone contarct, and you can have 5000 free minutes to any network of tak=lk time and you get one of the modern phones!
or think of it as a lower priced Lap top, or think of it as a TV Licence fee to watch TV,
Or even think how much this £240.00 can off set your council tax or your house insurance, or even your car insurance!
many of us don't even think of it as a standing charge being levied indirectly, as most of the consumers were fooled by energy companies who very proudly announced that they have removed all standing charges for their customers.....hold on a minute.....what a pack of lies.........so why have they then formed a tier system of pricing, where customers are charges quite a lot more for their first tier, and only after that the price becomes what it should have been in the first place.
Oh wait a minute.....its for infra structure ! for laying pipelines, for transporting energy, for the metering, oh yes....go on.....
I was goingto really moan about this with eon, my energy supplier, as I remember their representatives knocked on my door and asked me to sign up a contarct with them as they do not have stsnding charge!
the only thing that stopped me from complaining was the fcat they gave me 10% discount on gas and 6% on electricity. Which actually cancelled the equivalent standing charge.
So how come petrol garages don't charge their customers (drivers) two tier system for delivering fuel? they have to own forecourts, install pumps, employ till staff, pay for council tax for the premises, rents, maintenec, deliveries, and so how come they have one single rate or a single tier for fuel and so why should gas and electricity be qny different, end of the day it is still the energy just as much as petrol is.
I think there should be one single energy tier rate, and just as motorist have a choice which garage to fill their tanks from, like wise consumers should be able to choose from which supplier he wants his energy billed by.
its not a marginal rate its the same with every supplier ??
standing charge or equivilent then the unit cost they are all the same
yes they muddy the water with higher standing charge or greater discounted duel fuel bonuses ect
but what i have quoted it the normal rate
I don't have a standing charge.
neither do i all they do is so many units a quarter at one rate to the equivilent of the quarterly standing charge
then the rest at the normal rate
Leave the bath full when you get out as it's still warm.
G
gaswizzard
I'm with Eon to which I pay 8.2 pence for the first 2,600 kw used then 3.55 pence there after , this is spread over 12 months so every quarter I pay the premium charge of 8.2 pence for the first 600 kw used.
Welcome to rip off britain.
Welcome to rip off britain.
Thats what I mean, so you are actually paying equivalent of 8.2 - 3.55 = 4.65p per kilo watt extra for the first 650 units per quarter, per fuel, Electric is slightly more, that is what I said on average you are paying around £20 a month in these hidden charges!
Npower has even worst set up, as they spread these first tier in such a stupid manner, that you would need a degree to work out, as they don't spread the extra charges evenly throughout the year, infact to make it worst, they charge more units at the worst possible time, that is during winter they allocate a lot more units for the first tier in winter months, and in summer when your energy usage is minimum, they allocate a fewer higher tier units.
In other words, like eon spread 2600 evenly over a year, or 650 per quarter, Npower would be like allocating 1200 over Dec/Jan/Feb! (the figure may not be exact, I just used 1200 to give an example, thats why i left them and went with eon!
and in summer, npower would allocate like say 300 units for higher tier! they have got a completly twisted system that is so hard to work out. they obviously done this on purpose to make it harder for us to work out so that when they do try to explain we get even more confused.
but the bottom line is they do this in order to guarantee their revenue since they know winter months are the best time to extract as much from the consumers as their energy usage will be more, you see if your energy usage is below 650 per quarter in the summer months then they loose out! since if a customer may only burn or uses 400 units in a summer quarter, so they can't exatract the equivalent of full standing charge in summer months!
Npower has even worst set up, as they spread these first tier in such a stupid manner, that you would need a degree to work out, as they don't spread the extra charges evenly throughout the year, infact to make it worst, they charge more units at the worst possible time, that is during winter they allocate a lot more units for the first tier in winter months, and in summer when your energy usage is minimum, they allocate a fewer higher tier units.
In other words, like eon spread 2600 evenly over a year, or 650 per quarter, Npower would be like allocating 1200 over Dec/Jan/Feb! (the figure may not be exact, I just used 1200 to give an example, thats why i left them and went with eon!
and in summer, npower would allocate like say 300 units for higher tier! they have got a completly twisted system that is so hard to work out. they obviously done this on purpose to make it harder for us to work out so that when they do try to explain we get even more confused.
but the bottom line is they do this in order to guarantee their revenue since they know winter months are the best time to extract as much from the consumers as their energy usage will be more, you see if your energy usage is below 650 per quarter in the summer months then they loose out! since if a customer may only burn or uses 400 units in a summer quarter, so they can't exatract the equivalent of full standing charge in summer months!
i have done the maths for those that care
the higher units equate to a gas standing charge for the year of £102 11p or £25 53 per quarter
electric £82 70p a year or £20 70 per quarter
so total standing charge of £46.23 per quarter 51p per day £3.56p per week 15.26 per month or £14.22 per 4 weeks including vat
there you are no room for misunderstanding my tarrif now
the higher units equate to a gas standing charge for the year of £102 11p or £25 53 per quarter
electric £82 70p a year or £20 70 per quarter
so total standing charge of £46.23 per quarter 51p per day £3.56p per week 15.26 per month or £14.22 per 4 weeks including vat
there you are no room for misunderstanding my tarrif now
i know exactly what you mean
i look at things and often perceive them differently to most
to be honest when you tend to be an individual we find our own way to understand things to our own satisfaction usually the complete opposite to the way we are expected to come to that conclusion or answer
When there used to be a standing charge, there used to be only one single tier or single rate irrespective of how many units of energy you used, when the energy providers took that away, and openly boasted about how they no longer make a standing charge, but they didn't tell the consumers, oh well we found another way around conning you by introducing a two tier terrif system!
Don't need much to work that out, and if you work it out, the higher first terrif works exactly what would have been a standing charge.
As for avereging this cost, over a year, its fine, but one cannot really work this out unless one knows how much energy he is going to use, people who use small amounts of energy will of course pay more for their energy, yet those who use vast amounts will pay less per unit on average. si in the end it did not make any difference, standing charge is still there but kind of hidden in their two tier price structure. they take us for fools like we would not be able to work out why we have to pay a higher first terrif.
I would say, let the energy suppliers come up with an average, single, less complicated terrif that everyone knows how much gas & electricity would cost them irrespective of how many units they use, and so it is up to energy companies to spread any of their admin and infra structure costs built into the terrif, so we the consumers pay just a single rate terrif and don't have to work out the first so many units at x amount and then thereafter at y amount, its all a farce.
Further more, why should people who set up DD, or buy both fuels from a same supplier get any additional discounts, why not keep their prices as low as possible, and same for everyone irrespective how they pay!
We the consumers can just look at each supplier, check what their prices are without haveing the need to go to these websites who offer best energy deals because they can work out who would give yoiu a best deal, why isn't there such sites for pertrol? the answer is we don't need these bloody web sites as they earn their commission through refferal, but we the consumers end up paying for their advice that we did not need in the first place, with a simple single terrif, we can choose ourself who would be best for us, just like you would fill your tank and choose a garage that offers the best price per litre of fuel.
Don't need much to work that out, and if you work it out, the higher first terrif works exactly what would have been a standing charge.
As for avereging this cost, over a year, its fine, but one cannot really work this out unless one knows how much energy he is going to use, people who use small amounts of energy will of course pay more for their energy, yet those who use vast amounts will pay less per unit on average. si in the end it did not make any difference, standing charge is still there but kind of hidden in their two tier price structure. they take us for fools like we would not be able to work out why we have to pay a higher first terrif.
I would say, let the energy suppliers come up with an average, single, less complicated terrif that everyone knows how much gas & electricity would cost them irrespective of how many units they use, and so it is up to energy companies to spread any of their admin and infra structure costs built into the terrif, so we the consumers pay just a single rate terrif and don't have to work out the first so many units at x amount and then thereafter at y amount, its all a farce.
Further more, why should people who set up DD, or buy both fuels from a same supplier get any additional discounts, why not keep their prices as low as possible, and same for everyone irrespective how they pay!
We the consumers can just look at each supplier, check what their prices are without haveing the need to go to these websites who offer best energy deals because they can work out who would give yoiu a best deal, why isn't there such sites for pertrol? the answer is we don't need these bloody web sites as they earn their commission through refferal, but we the consumers end up paying for their advice that we did not need in the first place, with a simple single terrif, we can choose ourself who would be best for us, just like you would fill your tank and choose a garage that offers the best price per litre of fuel.
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