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Where is the white gloss that doesn't yellow?

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attractivebrunette

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Joined: 10 May 2008
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Location: Aberdeenshire,
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 26, 2009 11:04 pm Reply with quote

There is another thread on this topic but it's 4 years old.

My house is very dark inside and gets hardly any natural light. I've been told this is something that causes white gloss paint to 'yellow'.

However I can't re-paint all my doors and frames once a year (that's how long it's taken for my pure brilliant white gloss dulux trade paint to turn yellow).

I've heard there are some white gloss paints that dont' yellow, one being Dulux Trade Aquatech. But some people say it's a **** to get on and off and dries too quickly and simply isn't as good as normal oil based gloss paints.

Can anyone tell me what the deal is? I want some tough, hard-wearing trade brilliant white gloss that won't yellow. Is Aquatech any good? Any others?
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LJW61

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PostPosted: Mon Dec 28, 2009 7:09 pm Reply with quote

The reason oil-based paint yellows is due to the linseed oil oxidising - same way a cricket bat gets darker with age ...
Aquatech is water-based , it wont yellow but its c*** as far as application & durability goes.. icon_twisted.gif
Stick to oil-based but why not paint the woodwork a slightly off-white eggshell to start with?
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JohnD

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PostPosted: Mon Dec 28, 2009 7:51 pm Reply with quote

you don't smoke or use candles, do you?
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vernerbongo2

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PostPosted: Wed Dec 30, 2009 5:31 pm Reply with quote

As far as I can see all oil based white yellows after time, I agree with the other man water based is the only answer but its not as hard wearing and I think its Harder to put on as it dries very quick icon_surprised.gif
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JonB

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PostPosted: Wed Dec 30, 2009 7:08 pm Reply with quote

We used (about 9years ago) B&Q Low Odour white gloss which did not yellow , a pal enquired at B&Q for the same paint & was told it is now called B&Q magic gloss or similar.
JonB
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opps

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PostPosted: Thu Dec 31, 2009 12:33 pm Reply with quote

It is true that all oil based paint will yellow due to the ultraviolet light- not a problem for water (edit) based paint.

Over the last couple of years I have noticed that the Dulux Trade gloss has been yellowing faster than I would expect. The same does not seem to be true for the DT oil based eggshell. No idea why though- 95% of my jobs are eggshell so I am being very anecdotal

I too would recommend eggshell (off white- eg natural cotton)- faster (touch) drying, much nicer to work with as well, less scrubbable though


Last edited by opps on Wed Feb 23, 2011 1:15 pm, edited 1 time in total
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DuluxTrade2010

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PostPosted: Mon Jan 04, 2010 1:25 pm Reply with quote

Oil based paints are susceptible to a certain level of ‘yellowing’, so using a water-based system is the best way to ensure paintwork stays looking freshly painted for longer.

Dulux Trade Aquatech is no longer available, however water-based Ecosure Gloss and Undercoat have been launched which are easy to apply and will achieve the hardwearing and professional looking finish normally associated with solvent-based products. Ecosure products are also a more environmentally friendly choice compared to the solvent-based equivalent, with lower VOC content and less CO2 emitted during the manufacturing process.

To get the best from the Ecosure Gloss system:
* Use a synthetic brush
* Lightly dampen both the brush and the surface before application to increase the flow out
* Apply two coats of gloss for a glossier finish

See here for more information - http://www.icipaints.co.uk/products/ecosure/ecosure_gloss_undercoat.jsp

For an eggshell finish, I recommend Dulux Trade Diamond Eggshell or Ecosure Quick Drying Eggshell. Both paints are water-based and offer exceptional durability credentials.

Diamond Eggshell - http://www.icipaints.co.uk/products/info/dulux_trade_diamond_eggshell.jsp
Ecosure QD Eggshell - http://www.icipaints.co.uk/products/ecosure/ecosure_quick_drying_eggshell.jsp

Nicolas Guichard, Senior Brand Manager Dulux Trade
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opps

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PostPosted: Mon Jan 04, 2010 7:08 pm Reply with quote

Hi Nick

Glad to see input from the masters. I used to use the dulux trade forum- shame it went. IMHO the technical support was superior to the phone support.

Would you be willing to add your comments to the following when you get a mo.?

http://www.diynot.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=204643

Thanks
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DuluxTrade2010

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PostPosted: Tue Jan 05, 2010 9:33 am Reply with quote

Hello Opps,

Thanks for pointing me towards the thread about VOC compliant paints. In fact, this is one that I had spotted already and posted a reply on 15th December. If you have further questions on this subject though, post again and I’d be happy to add another comment.

Thanks again!

Nicolas Guichard, Senior Brand Manager Dulux Trade
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The following user says thank you to DuluxTrade2010 for this useful post:
opps (5 Jan 2010)
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opps

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PostPosted: Tue Jan 05, 2010 10:34 am Reply with quote

Sorry Nicolas, I missed your post- thanks for it.

I notice that your link explains that the new (oil-based) paints will yellow faster than previously. I appreciate that you (Dulux) were forced to make changes to the paints but I have never understood why UV inhibitors are not included in the paint or as a optional top coating in the first place.
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LJW61

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PostPosted: Wed Feb 23, 2011 12:53 pm Reply with quote

If you come over to take a look in the Bib n Braces forum you'll see that we're not impressed by water-based gloss/eggshell, it doesnt perform anywhere near as good as oil/solvent-based products icon_sad.gif
As for yellowing, Im having no end of customers calling me back to explain why their recently (VOC2010)painted woodwork is yellowing so quickly, sometimes noticable within 6-8 weeks!
Frankly this VOC stuff is causing us problems (all brands , this isnt a Dulux only issue)finacially as we're blamed for supplying the paint & some clients are requesting re-painting !
I tend to disagree about UV light , Its lack of sunlight that accelerates the yellowing, an example; On a recent job I had to paint four kitchen doors, I returned for more work there last week, one door had a hook on it where the owner had hung a (DRY) apron , when this was removed an exact yellow 'shadow' of the apron was distinctly visible ,the rest of the door was as white as could be expected when exposed to light. Weve all seen this effect inside cupboard doors ..
b] lwdcourt's[/b] mention of adding blue is a valid one, thats the difference between 'white' & 'Brilliant White', just look at the blue tint to washing powders, they use the same 'method'
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opps

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PostPosted: Wed Feb 23, 2011 1:01 pm Reply with quote

Hi, whilst not wanting to dismiss your suggestion out of hand I don't see how blue paint would work.

To begin with the yellowing is because of the absence of a particular part of the UV spectrum.

Exterior paint should not yellow unless it is deprived of the UV light.

AFAIK it is not the driers that result in yellowing but the medium itself, particularly things like linseed oil. This has been the case for hundreds of years, just look at old p(artist) aintings.

Brilliant white already has a small amount of blue added, without the blue it is plain old BS White (00E55).

Additionally blue paint (yellows/darkens)- if I paint a cupboard, the internal colour will end up darker than the exterior...

Sorry- you might be correct but I can't see how or why.
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LJW61

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PostPosted: Wed Feb 23, 2011 1:05 pm Reply with quote

No, youre right opps, I didnt mean it stopped yellowing, I just meant it appeared 'more white' at first application. As you say all shades of paint will yellow after time (unless sun-bleached)
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opps

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PostPosted: Wed Feb 23, 2011 1:09 pm Reply with quote

LJW61 wrote:
If you come over to take a look in the Bib n Braces forum you'll see that we're not impressed by water-based gloss/eggshell, it doesnt perform anywhere near as good as oil/solvent-based products icon_sad.gif
As for yellowing, Im having no end of customers calling me back to explain why their recently (VOC2010)painted woodwork is yellowing so quickly, sometimes noticable within 6-8 weeks!
Frankly this VOC stuff is causing us problems (all brands , this isnt a Dulux only issue)finacially as we're blamed for supplying the paint & some clients are requesting re-painting !
I tend to disagree about UV light , Its lack of sunlight that accelerates the yellowing, an example; On a recent job I had to paint four kitchen doors, I returned for more work there last week, one door had a hook on it where the owner had hung a (DRY) apron , when this was removed an exact yellow 'shadow' of the apron was distinctly visible ,the rest of the door was as white as could be expected when exposed to light. Weve all seen this effect inside cupboard doors ..
b] lwdcourt's[/b] mention of adding blue is a valid one, thats the difference between 'white' & 'Brilliant White', just look at the blue tint to washing powders, they use the same 'method'


opps- you beat me to it.....

Haven't you noticed that post VOC2010 paints in the tin even yellow, eg if you have a tin that is half full the bit clinging to the upper sides or lid are yellowed in weeks.

I now recommend customers to go for off whites rather than white so that the yellowing is less obvious.

The maths behind VOC reduction don't add up- surfaces will be painted more often- I use more driers, Owatrol and white spirit than before and I am using more Acid Cat than previously.

Daft....
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opps

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PostPosted: Wed Feb 23, 2011 1:12 pm Reply with quote

Hi LJW

My response was to the other (conspiracy icon_question.gif ) fellow not you- out of sync- story of my life...
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