Accces Control RFID Deedlock Magnetic Lock problem

Hi!
Just installed a maglock on the door. It is an external door that opens inwards.
So, the maglock goes on the wall in a slot cut from the architrave.



The magnet is perched on the architrave and so sticks out proud of it.
Had to shell out for a 'Z+L bracket' that bolts the armature onto the 'Z' bracket that is screwed onto the door. The brackets are just arbitrarily shaped bits of thick aluminium. Should not be needed. You ought to be able top use any standard B+Q part - all it's doing is trying to compensate for the poor design.

Worse, the magnet is screwed to the architrave alu bracket by bolts which go up through it - so the magnet has nothing sticking it horizontally - the very direction of the force.

They're all like this as far as I can google and they've been making them like this for ages - looks like the maglock industry is asleep!

The armature has a central bolt and two extra holes. I am using the bolt but can't figure out how to use the extra holes. The 'manual' is a poorly written set of pages that mis-explains the procedure and doesn't mention how to do it. There are two split cylinders that are to be used, but I can't figure out how as the bottom of the armature hole is a rounded pit and the cylinders are loose in the hole. I presume you screw something into them, but they are also too long for the hole..

I'd like to contact Deedlock but can't find their website.
Anyone solved this?

Chris

nlondoner said:

Hi!
Just installed a maglock on the door. It is an external door that opens inwards.
So, the maglock goes on the wall in a slot cut from the architrave.

The magnet is perched on the architrave and so sticks out proud of it.
Had to shell out for a 'Z+L bracket' that bolts the armature onto the 'Z' bracket that is screwed onto the door. The brackets are just arbitrarily shaped bits of thick aluminium. Should not be needed. You ought to be able top use any standard B+Q part - all it's doing is trying to compensate for the poor design.

Worse, the magnet is screwed to the architrave alu bracket by bolts which go up through it - so the magnet has nothing sticking it horizontally - the very direction of the force.

They're all like this as far as I can google and they've been making them like this for ages - looks like the maglock industry is asleep!

The armature has a central bolt and two extra holes. I am using the bolt but can't figure out how to use the extra holes. The 'manual' is a poorly written set of pages that mis-explains the procedure and doesn't mention how to do it. There are two split cylinders that are to be used, but I can't figure out how as the bottom of the armature hole is a rounded pit and the cylinders are loose in the hole. I presume you screw something into them, but they are also too long for the hole..

I'd like to contact Deedlock but can't find their website.
Anyone solved this?

Chris

Click to expand...

So, you don't know what you are doing but feel expert enough to criticise the product.
I fit these all day long without a problem.
Arbitrarily shaped bits of ali?
I take it you didn't read the bit about holding force then?

Oh, and Deedlock is now a dormant company - the name isn't though. They now trade through the parent/holding company. I'll tell my mate Duncan, the MD to expect your call shall i?

The Z & L plates make the lock usable in various configurations.
So poor design? Nope.

The vertical fixings are stressed to the holding force of the lock, so what is the issue?

The extra offset holes are used to put the split pins in so the armature does not spin when the door is open and the mag de-energised. Also the two steel washers and rubber grommet are there to allow for discrepencies in the doors closuer.
Read the instructions its all there.

Your first mag lock then I take it.
I have fitted hundreds.

Thanks for your expert opinions.

i will agree with both of the residents on this forum,
having fitted loads of these mag locks, never had a problem.

The idea is, if you are not sure how to fit them, read the instructions!!!
they are easy to fit, and i mean very easy

Oasis

Thanks for your time in replying - I just want to do the best job possible, with the most appropriate materials. I posted here asking for help, in a way that might have helped others contemplating the same - sorry if I come across as a pratt- no-one's perfect.

>>So, you don't know what you are doing but feel expert enough to criticise the product.

The product is not claiming to require an expert to fit - my opinions are based on what I think as a reasonably competent person - the product is aimed at people like me - there are no 'experts'.

I do know what I'm doing and I want improvements. As you've got so much experience, don't you have a list yourself you could mention? Do you have a big bin full of the extra bits left over from all those fittings? I think the product is capable of considerable improvement - don't you?

>>Oh, and Deedlock is now a dormant company - the name isn't though. They now trade through the parent/holding company. I'll tell my mate Duncan, the MD to expect your call shall i?

What's the website URL? As far as I can tell, there have been no changes made to this product since it was first made many years ago. I think there is room for improvement and it's a shame they couldn't be bothered - would have made my life easier.

As soon as someone brings out a better product, this one will disappear without trace - serves them right. They probably only survive because the product is heavy, so Chinese versions are at a disadvantage. Products where there is no contact details in the documentation, the maker is untraceable in google and that don't have a website are just taking the p IMHO.

Thanks for taking the time to reply -I appreciate it.
>>The Z & L plates make the lock usable in various configurations.
So poor design? Nope.

The Z&L brackets mean that every use of them leaves you with an unnecessary bit you paid for but cannot use. The least they could have done was to make it possible to just order the addon you need, not the whole thing - £15+VAT+delivery for a few bits of aluminium seems dear to me, especially as they only serve to hold the armature proud of the door and have no magnetic purpose. The product could be designed to accept a variety of ways to hold the armature away from the door, or even to not require that. The brackets could have been designed to slot together differently and more flexibly - that would have suited me.

>>The vertical fixings are stressed to the holding force of the lock, so what is the issue?

If you want to fix something to a door frame, you want to use fixings that are horizontal to the frame - simply adding some holes would do the job - why did they choose to do it bass ackwards?

>> The extra offset holes are used to put the split pins in so the armature does not spin when the door is open and the mag de-energised.

Thanks but I just don't get it - the split cylinders (they're not split pins http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Split_pin , although I know why you mean) are loose in the holes and I can't see how it works - any ideas?

>>Also the two steel washers and rubber grommet are there to allow for discrepencies in the doors closuer.
This is another aspect of the design - it's just a crude way of doing it IMO and looks ugly - the washers and the end of the bolt with the nut on it stick out of the middle of the armature and there is no way of knowing how tight they should be.

Read the instructions its all there.
>> Done that! Really hard to read, small diags and tiny print - most of it irrelevant

>>Your first mag lock then I take it. I have fitted hundreds.

Do you not want them improved? The very idea of the maglock is hardly 'green' - they should maybe all be fitted with a PIR - is that what you add each time to avoid them being powered on 24 hours a day but only needed for minutes?

They often don't work I'm told, as people simply kick the door in. Why is this one designed to be put on the top of the door only? Why can't they accommodate installing it where a rim lock is normally placed - in the 'middle' of the door edge?

The idea of attaching a magnet to a flexible door is doomed to failure surely - the door will move over time. When you re-visit the ones you fitted, do they need adjustment? There seems no mechanism to do that without dismantling it - another opportunity to improve the design IMO.

>>Thanks for your expert opinions.
Sorry to come across as annoying - I know you help a lot of people and am grateful for that - I remind you that to stay young you need to encompass constant change...

oasistechnical said:

i will agree with both of the residents on this forum,
having fitted loads of these mag locks, never had a problem.

The idea is, if you are not sure how to fit them, read the instructions!!!
they are easy to fit, and i mean very easy

Oasis

Click to expand...

How do you fit the split cylinders? I just don't get it - the holes they go in aren't threaded and they are loose in them.
C.

Oh boy, these are such badly designed things, aren't they? - NO

I've fitted a couple to GLASS doors with no problems, it's amazing what different fixing kits there are, very flexible kit.

OP,
Why is it all those in the trade who fit them find them perfectly adequate?
You seem to be referring to one door - singular.

How would you view things regarding Z&Ls if you were on a job with many doors, none of which fitted 'perfectly'.??

The reason for the rubber washer is to allow 'play' in the Armature plate. It should not be held tight/immobile.

Regarding the effectivenrss of the lock on a door that may flex. So what?
It is there for access control. NOT fort knox security. Anyone forces the door open, relevant alarm should sound prompting action. That said, if fitted correctly, you will have trouble forcing a door.

As for fitting a mag in the middle of a door/frame. You haven't give it much thought have you? Safety issues to start with, and yes, these come under the building regs.

I suggest you look into the subject more before trying to put the industry to rights - especially with regard to your comment about linking them to a pir and being powered all day.
I await your response on maglocks that only need power to unlock them.

alumni said:

OP,
The reason for the rubber washer is to allow 'play' in the Armature plate. It should not be held tight/immobile.

Click to expand...

Its surprising how many doors are warped or warp over time.

I wonder what the play in the rubber washer has on a door like that?

Ah I know, it allows the the two parts to meet squarely so ..... , I'll not go on because you will not understand.

nlondoner said:

- I just want to do the best job possible, with the most appropriate materials.

Click to expand...

Then get the lock with the appropriate fixings, there must be about 10 different ones out there, some look very good when used in the correct situation.

But of course you know all that don't you, found the different types of kit when you did your research before you decided on the wrong one.

Europlex said:

alumni said:

OP,
The reason for the rubber washer is to allow 'play' in the Armature plate. It should not be held tight/immobile.

Click to expand...

Its surprising how many doors are warped or warp over time.

I wonder what the play in the rubber washer has on a door like that?

Ah I know, it allows the the two parts to meet squarely so ..... , I'll not go on because you will not understand.

Click to expand...

I'm guessing that's not aimed at me?

It's certainly not, sorry, I got carried away.

(Perhaps I should be, by the men in white coats)

Christ the OP is a bell end.

1, PIR to activate to save power? Drop the power the door is OPEN .......jeeez.
2, A lot of parts are supplied to ensure it can be fitted, so what if there are spares we use them. You on a one off wont, tough titty.
3,The washers stick out, only if you fit them wrong.
A tip, use locktight on the thread, it wont back off after 6 months then with idiots tugging when not de-energised.
4,The instruction irrelevant? So how do others get on then.


I give up, you make out your intelligent and yet rant like a 8 yr old.

You know nothing, actually you mention

I remind you that to stay young you need to encompass constant change...

Click to expand...

then go on to say

Why can't they accommodate installing it where a rim lock is normally placed - in the 'middle' of the door edge?

Click to expand...

Some thing done for 100`s of years ( I am a trained locksmith and have indepth knowledge of the founding of the profession).

You cannot have it both ways.
They make accessories to mount the mag as you suggest, also a flush mag, with nothing visable, top or bottom mounted.
Same mag can be fitted to a glass door.

So many variations.

You have proven your lack of knowledge, time and time again.

So cya, go bother another trade.
You could try telling electritians that copper is a poor conductor and why do they work under the floors.....................A Plumber that water is passe, why not use ultrasonics.

Cya