Cooker and hob fitting advice needed
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holmslaw
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holmslaw
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No, it's not clipped direct, but you could argue it's in free air...
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H
holmslaw
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I was contemplating using that as an argument but thought it would not be considered free air as such.
However, it seems a bit harsh to derate the cable (because it is not touching a surface) to a method where it is touching a surface and covered in thermal insulation.
Well, it's 40A for round cable but I don't know where that takes us as it's not mentioned for flat.
... and if you look at 4D2A, where both reference methods are shown, you'll see that for the same cable Ref E gives a higher value than Ref C.
So what is the maximum current of a cable in free air compared to when "clipped direct" ?
What decides that ( apparently ) clipped direct cable can (safely) carry more current than the same cable in free air. ?
Does the surface that the cable is clipped to act as a heat sink to keep the cable cool ? Clipped to timber ? , timber not a good conductor of heat so would not be an effective heat sink ? And how long until the surface warms up and no longer cools the cable. Does the cable's maximum current rating then become reduced.
Or is it that in free air the cable is not supported and would soften and sag as it warmed up ?
It can't - have a look at the tables.
Why that is the case I don't know, as I would have thought a clippable surface would offer better heat transfer (through conduction) than the natural convection of air.
Of course, the problem is that you can't clip cables perfectly flat, so there will likely be a small air gap between the two surfaces which will act as an insulating medium. That, and the fact that they could be clipped to wood as you suggest, are probably the main reasons why free air is 'better'.
Hi Guys,
Thanks for the response to my questions..Sorry not replied earlier only been away.
So i have now decided to go with the click dual out let plate and use 6mm T&E for connecting both appliances as 6mm should fit ok in the click 45 dual outlet plate.
all the best
Pipefitter.
Thanks for the response to my questions..Sorry not replied earlier only been away.
So i have now decided to go with the click dual out let plate and use 6mm T&E for connecting both appliances as 6mm should fit ok in the click 45 dual outlet plate.
all the best
Pipefitter.
Interestingly, if you look at Table 4A2 at what we call 'clipped direct' (Number 20, Method C) it is actually defined as clipped direct to a wooden or masonary wall OR spaced not more than 0.3 cable diameters from such a wall (e.g. attached with cleats). They are therefore not banking on direct conduction at all in arriving at that Method and one can but presume that it is, indeed, the inteference with 'free convection' resulting from the proximity to a wall which results in the lower CCC than 'in free air'.
Kind Regards, John.
Because they are designing for the market which has 16A radials and 16A sockets, and is several times larger than the UK one with its anomalous combination of 32A circuits and 13A sockets.
We have a weird, out-on-a-limb, nobody-else-does-it-like-that design for socket circuits, and you've hit one of the downsides of that.
Thanks all for replying..if i was told that i could use the click 45 dual outlet plate from the off ,as the 16 amp euro socket really don't apply here ,then i would have got my answer a lot quicker lol .Instead i was told to have a 16amp fitted or that is what i presumed was said.
Thanks
Well - you shouldn't connect it straight to that outlet plate because:
Now - assuming that you don't find that the terminals in the oven are to small to take the size of cable you have to use on a 32A supply, in reality you'd probably get away with it, but there is an outside chance that if something goes wrong inside the oven, and Bosch were relying on the presence of a 16A device to protect their appliance, a hazard could arise and/or you'd find your warranty invalidated.
and that outlet plate is on a 32A circuit.
Now - assuming that you don't find that the terminals in the oven are to small to take the size of cable you have to use on a 32A supply, in reality you'd probably get away with it, but there is an outside chance that if something goes wrong inside the oven, and Bosch were relying on the presence of a 16A device to protect their appliance, a hazard could arise and/or you'd find your warranty invalidated.
Maybe so ,but i don't think anyone in this country would go to all that trouble to fit a 16amp socket ? also one could argue that bosch don't really take the UK in to account when making these hobs.
Also as stated ,the protection is really for the cable and not the hob,if there is a fault the consumer would trip before anything major happened .
Also all hobs i have come across will take 6mm cable if cannot be fitted with a standard plug .
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