Rounded off screws in boiler won't budge!? - Help!

[Statia]

Hi,

I've inherited a Glow worm Micron 50FF boiler and the two hardened,
self tapping screws which hold the combustion chamber cover on are
completely ceased, refuse to move and are rounded off nicely.

http://img143.imageshack.us/my.php?image=boiler1wz9.png

http://img112.imageshack.us/my.php?image=boiler2bn0.png

http://img396.imageshack.us/my.php?image=boiler3wy4.png

The trouble is they are in a recess so I can't get in there with a
hack saw and cut a groove into them. I've also tried using a set of
damaged screw remover drill bit things, but all they do is round them
off more. Drilling also does nothing as they're hardened.

Has anyone got any ideas about how to remove these screws so I can
hoover out the burner? I suspect that even though the boiler was
serviced before we moved in 18 months ago as we have the cert', I
doubt it's really had one for some time as the man from Grittish Bas
wouldn't have been able to get these screws out either. I want to get
my heating running as efficient as possible with all these gas
price hikes!

Many thanks

 

[Corgigrouch]

With all due respect, are you really sure that you should be messing inside your boiler? I think not....

Are you saying that the BG man couldn't get the screws out or are you saying that you don't think that a BG man could get those screws out?

And when you have done, how would you know that your boiler is running as efficiently as it could?

If you have a BG contract, which would appear to be the case from what you have said, let them do their job, if not call someone who is registered..

 

[Paul Barker]

Second that

you are not likely to make a blind but of difference to gas usage.

Any one of us could get those screws out we have to do these things all the time.

British gas would check combustion performance and leave well alone if good.

We could teach you to gas rate the appliance and if it is not correct advise you to get someone in to check burner pressure.

 

[Paul Barker]

As for panicking because of high fuel bills.

We are all sick of people thinking something can be done. It is the new costof gas and a newer costis coming which will make things much worseand itwill never get better.

my gas bill last winter quater for a house and a flat was £1300

Shall i start taking the combustion chamber of my boiler apart? not on your nelly. And i am qualified to do so.

 

[muggles]

Grouch is right, get the hell out of your boiler and leave it to the pro's. You're not allowed to go as far as you have already, please don't go any further.

Incidentally have you considered that these 'rounded screws' may in fact have been security screws requiring a special glowworm screwdriver, and that your attempts to get them out with screw removers may well have completely b*ggered them so that they cannot now be removed with said screwdriver? I suspect you may have just caused yourself extra unnecessary expense.

 

[Statia]

They're not special screws. Some chump rounded them off before we moved in. I suspect a "professional" from Britsh Gas was most likely. They obviously just walked away from it, so why on earth would I get them back again?

We don't have a BG contract nor would I touch one with a barge pole. When the PCB and thermistor went in it last winter, I fixed it myself and got change out of £100. If I'd have got British Gas in or some central heating engineer, I'd probably have got the "can't get parts for this, you need a new boiler" BS.

I am not some idiot who thinks messing inside a boiler is a game. I'd rather replace these screws when I don't need the heating on so that if I/someone else needs to get them out at a later date due to a breakdown, it's not necessary for me to pay a qualified man £x per hour to do something I can do myself. I'd also like to stick the nozzle of the hoover in there to pick up any combistion debris. It's hardly messing with gas parts. Besides, a glow worm micron boiler is hardly rocket science is it?

I was hoping for some replies which would have pointed me in the right direction. I was obviously mistaken thinking this was a "do-it-yourself" help site. Maybe it's the fact that people like me deprive heating engineers of income and keeps cash in my pocket which touches a nerve?

 

[muggles]

OK, I'll agree with you on one thing here. British Gas are not the people to go for, get CORGI plumber.

If you're taking the cover off the combustion chamber then you most certainly are messing around with gas parts - this is, after all, where the gas...combusts. If you damage the seal in removing it (and actually some manufacturers insist that the seal must be replaced if the cover is removed) then you could end up with combustion gases spilling into the room. This is extremely dangerous.

All the replies ARE pointing you in the right direction, as they are all saying leave it alone and get someone in who knows what they are doing. This is most certainly NOT a DIY job and you shouldn't be doing it.

What touches a nerve is eejits messing around with things they don't fully understand, and endangering people's lives in the process. Yes, we must make a living, same as everyone, but that really isn't the point here. It's highly unlikely that you would end up phoning one of the CORGI's on here to do your service anyway, just because there are a lot around and relatively few here, so advice can be given without being at all interested in the financial side of it. Incidentally gas boiler services aren't horrendously expensive, my company currently charge £65+VAT, assuming it's not miles and miles away.

 

[tazman]

Hi, I read you've tried drilling these screw out and expect it was a high speed steel it you were using. I believe you'll need to use a drill bit which is considerably harder, probably a soild carbide or tungsten one.
I recall having to use some as an apprentice many years ago to open out the fixing holes in a couple of replacement vice jaws.
Good luck.
Ps, it really is heartwarming to see that so many posters on this site hold your interests so dearly.

 

[Statia]

Thanks for your sensible reply.

I have all of the manuals for my boiler, so I will read it thoroughly to see what it says about taking the combustion cover off before I go any further. I could always just replace the screws without taking the cover off. Job done.

Ok, so £65+vat isn't the end of the world for a boiler service. But you can see my situation here. The people in the house before us didn't have much of a hand in DIY and certainly wouldn't be watching the BG man whilst he so-called serviced the boiler previously. So the engineer looks at the knackered screws, thinks "well, who'll know if I don't bother with getting the cover off?, I'll just leave it", and walks away from it, leaving essentially broken parts (ok so they're just screws). So I get in someone else to service the boiler. Who's to say they won't look at the screws again and not bother with them? They're more trouble than they're worth by the look of it to an engineer, so I've just paid to have half a job done!

Tell me then, what would you do if you came to my house, took the cover off the boiler and saw them screws? Would you spend a few hours trying to get them out so you could say you'd done a full, good job. Or would you also think sod it, my gaffer's booked me in for another half dozen of these today, they don't pay me enough for this sh** and I want to be home by 4pm? I bet 999 out of 1000 heating engineers would do the latter because no matter how much you pay, people never look after others stuff as if it was their own. This is exactly why I won't pay someone to come in and do something I can do with more care and attention myself and keep my money in my pocket, where it does me most benefit.

At least if I can replace these damned screws, I might get a proper service if I got someone in.

 

[muggles]

Hi, I read you've tried drilling these screw out and expect it was a high speed steel it you were using. I believe you'll need to use a drill bit which is considerably harder, probably a soild carbide or tungsten one.
I recall having to use some as an apprentice many years ago to open out the fixing holes in a couple of replacement vice jaws.

Hmm not quite the same thing here is it? A vice ain't going to kill you if you mess up, and drilling out risks stripping the threads, which in turn will mean getting a new combustion chamber, watch the costs spiral then...

Ps, it really is heartwarming to see that so many posters on this site hold your interests so dearly.

We're a caring lot

 

[muggles]

Tell me then, what would you do if you came to my house, took the cover off the boiler and saw them screws? Would you spend a few hours trying to get them out so you could say you'd done a full, good job. Or would you also think s** it, my gaffer's booked me in for another half dozen of these today, they don't pay me enough for this sh** and I want to be home by 4pm? I bet 999 out of 1000 heating engineers would do the latter because no matter how much you pay, people never look after others stuff as if it was their own.

I'd take them out and do it properly.

 

[mattylad]

Even if the thread was to get stripped, have you never heard of a tap? of bigger screws? there is nowt special about them.

And the OP does have a damned good point, why pay some overpriced guy to do exactly what he can do himself to make the job better for the Corgi engineer if he gets one in.

Statia, can you get a pair of pliers around the head? perhaps mole grips?

Drilling is likely to be your final answer as said and you may well be needing slightly larger new screws so it may be an idea to take 1 ou & nip down a hardware store for some larger replacements first.

 

[Watchmaker]

Statia. Are you able to get a small grinding wheel to these screw heads? If so, it should be possible to grind the heads away, remove the cover, carry out your vacuuming and, when replacing the cover, re-drill it in a slightly different location, and secure it with two new self tapping screws.

 

[tonybhoy]

An engineer doesn't have to get into the combustion chamber to check the boiler's efficiency.

He only needs to get in there if the boiler requires a service.

Ever hear of the phrase 'if it ain't broke don't fix it'?

 

[sambotc]

You sure there hardened, cant be that hard if a screwdriver has rounded them surely? Can you not just use a hacksaw blade and with some patience cut a groove?

Maybe worth trying a new HSS bit on a slower drilling speed?

Bit late ranting on about what he should and shouldn't be doing as the combustion casing is already off in the picture so you've already gone further than you should have!