Safety that's why we should get out of the EU

[EFLImpudence]

 

[fender]

I don't believe you sincerely want to prevent British people going to Spain, or Spanish people coming to Britain.

Why won't the anti-EU campaigners tell us what their anti-foreigner laws and treaties would say?

People could still move around. Difference is they may have to apply for a visa etc, have proper checks carried out, have their vehicle searched at a border for the odd suicide vest and AK..

 

[JohnD]

may?

Which people would, and would not, need a visa?

And you say you would search all people, vehicles and all luggage at ports, airports and chunnel arrival?

How would you seal the border with Ireland (and possibly Scotland)?

Mitch thinks that people with money would get an easier ride. How much money will they need, and how will they prove it?

Why have your friends Nigel and Boris not publicised their proposals?

 

[Deleted member 63160]

Mitch thinks that people with money would get an easier ride.

I simply stated that Brits would always be welcome in Spain because they take money and spend it there.

 

[fender]

may?

Which people would, and would not, need a visa?
Anyone who wants to visit another country

And you say you would search all people, vehicles and all luggage at ports, airports and chunnel arrival?
In light of the current situation, you don't think security should be stepped up?

How would you seal the border with Ireland (and possibly Scotland)?
When were they mentioned?

Mitch thinks that people with money would get an easier ride. How much money will they need, and how will they prove it?
He's answered you.

Why have your friends Nigel and Boris not publicised their proposals?
Don't know, why don't you ask them.

 

[JohnD]

Is it three quarters of a million British immigrants in Spain now?

If the UK implements anti-foreigner laws, do you think that EU countries won't implement reciprocal treaties? If it's the migrants with money they welcome, how will they screen out and reject the less prosperous ones?

Equally, how will we screen out and reject the less prosperous Spaniards?

 

[JohnD]

Which people would, and would not, need a visa?
Anyone who wants to visit another country
So you say anyone from outside the UK would need a visa.

And you say you would search all people, vehicles and all luggage at ports, airports and chunnel arrival?
In light of the current situation, you don't think security should be stepped up?
Why are you guessing what I think your proposals are?

How would you seal the border with Ireland (and possibly Scotland)?
When were they mentioned?
Why are you saying now that people from some foreign countries would not need visas?

Mitch thinks that people with money would get an easier ride. How much money will they need, and how will they prove it?
He's answered you.
No, he did not answer either of my questions.

Why have your friends Nigel and Boris not publicised their proposals?
Don't know, why don't you ask them.
If you're campaigning for UK to resign from the EU, you and your friends need to tell us what you're proposing.

 

[Himaginn]

Last time I looked, it was something like £250 for a UK tourist visa. Business visas and longer term visas normally are considerably more expensive.
That'll encourage a lot of EU visitors.
Normally EU visitors baggage, vehicle checks etc are less rigorous than for non-EU visitors. I accept that in times of heightened security more rigorous checks may be carried out and are necessary. But if the norm was to become rigorous checks for all visitors, all the time, the border agency will be recruiting extra staff, and obviously will need additional resources.

 

[tony1851]

blah blah blah blah...........

Lots of facts, figures, dates and personalities, but all that doesn't alter the fact

A very inelegant response there, tony, to my well researched and well supported comments. No attempt at a reasoned argument or sensible debate. Just a zoom off on a different trajectory, with absolutely nothing to explain or substantiate your opinion. But I'll respond, at least as much as I can from your ineloquent statement.

that with open borders, the EU is not safe from jihadists - that's the top and bottom of it.

Your statement is a wide and wild assertion about something which you fail to specifically address.

Are you referring to EU external borders being open? Clearly they are not.

If the EU's external borders are not open, then how come Europe is being gatecrashed every day by hordes from the ME and N Africa? Clearly, the EU cannot defend its own borders, and has to pay someone else to do it - what a complete shambles the EU is.

Experience through history shows that no one power can effectively control Europe as an Empire, from the Holy Roman Empire, through Napoleon, and to the Nazis. The nations are just too different in culture for this to happen and anyone who thinks otherwise is deluding themselves.

 

[Himaginn]

Lots of facts, figures, dates and personalities, but all that doesn't alter the fact

A very inelegant response there, tony, to my well researched and well supported comments. No attempt at a reasoned argument or sensible debate. Just a zoom off on a different trajectory, with absolutely nothing to explain or substantiate your opinion. But I'll respond, at least as much as I can from your ineloquent statement.

that with open borders, the EU is not safe from jihadists - that's the top and bottom of it.

Your statement is a wide and wild assertion about something which you fail to specifically address.
Are you referring to EU external borders being open? Clearly they are not.

If the EU's external borders are not open, then how come Europe is being gatecrashed every day by hordes from the ME and N Africa? Clearly, the EU cannot defend its own borders,

There isn't a fence around Europe, just as there isn't a fence around the UK.
To draw a parallel such as this is to suggest that UK has open borders. Obviously there are recognised border crossings. If people disregard those points and arrive at a beach somewhere, then that is not a recognised border crossing and, ordinarily would not be staffed. Equally obviously, once that 'breach' has been noticed, it is regularly staffed. But you do not normally turn away refugees. You seek to offer genuine refugees refuge, and others to be repatriated. That process is being followed, but unfortunately for Greece they been left to cope without EU assistance, up until now. You may recall I thought it was a failing of EU, including UK.
You seem to be suggesting that we should ignore humanitarian, and probably also UN practice, on refugees processing. That would be illegal.

and has to pay someone else to do it

Please tell us who is being paid to defend the borders of EU?

Experience through history shows that no one power can effectively control Europe as an Empire, from the Holy Roman Empire, through Napoleon, and to the Nazis. The nations are just too different in culture for this to happen

That argument could just as easily apply to America, UK even, etc.
Apart from that EU does not 'control' Europe. It is a democratic organisation, legislating by permission of the people. Look up Democratic Government.

and anyone who thinks otherwise is deluding themselves.

Anyone who thinks that EU is ruling Europe by force, or decree, is deluding themselves.

 

[EFLImpudence]

Apart from that EU does not 'control' Europe. It is a democratic organisation, legislating by permission of the people. Look up Democratic Government.

You will have no gripe, then, should Britain decide to leave.

and anyone who thinks otherwise is deluding themselves.
Anyone who thinks that EU is ruling Europe by force, or decree, is deluding themselves.

You really should watch the video of Hungarian PM.

 

[JohnD]

Do you consider that a newspaper article is equivalent to an invasion by tanks?

 

[fender]

Which people would, and would not, need a visa?
Anyone who wants to visit another country
So you say anyone from outside the UK would need a visa.

And you say you would search all people, vehicles and all luggage at ports, airports and chunnel arrival?
In light of the current situation, you don't think security should be stepped up?
Why are you guessing what I think your proposals are?

How would you seal the border with Ireland (and possibly Scotland)?
When were they mentioned?
Why are you saying now that people from some foreign countries would not need visas?

Mitch thinks that people with money would get an easier ride. How much money will they need, and how will they prove it?
He's answered you.
No, he did not answer either of my questions.

Why have your friends Nigel and Boris not publicised their proposals?
Don't know, why don't you ask them.
If you're campaigning for UK to resign from the EU, you and your friends need to tell us what you're proposing.

If a member of your family, or one of your friends got blown up and killed, would you still be such a pee taking tosser?

Is it a joke to you if people want to increase security and take the current situation seriously?

 

[JohnD]

Oh fendy, you are funny. You have convinced yourself that European countries which co-operate must suffer more terrorist attacks than countries which distrust and fear each other.

Your fear of foreigners is leading you astray.

And you seem unable to say what isolationist laws your anti-foreigner politicians would introduce. Maybe they don't know. So you are campaigning for something but you don't know what it is.

Why do you think that the border with Ireland should be undefended?

 

[EFLImpudence]

Do you consider that a newspaper article is equivalent to an invasion by tanks?

Can you not read?

You don't have to believe but that will not change the facts.