Using pre installed cooker circuit for 13amp or 16amp oven. (2)

[JohnW2]

Because, according to you, an oven should be on its own 16amp MCB in case an element gets a partial short.

I think this whole argument is about the bit of cable (usually flex) from the cooking appliance(s) to the fixed installation. If that has a high enough CSA to be adequately protected by a 32A OPD (which is unlikley), and assuming the fixed cabling of circuit was OK for 32A, then a 32A OPD would be OK in terms of cable protection. Sunray appears to be saying that if that flex/whatever is only adequate for 16A, then a 16A OPD is required because of the (extremely small) probability of the 'partial short'.

 

[SUNRAY]

Remove the link between the two L terminations and then two separate cables from two separate over current protection devices ( MCB ) can be connected the one appliance.

DIYnot.com
AEG Cooker CCB6761ACB Fitting query | DIYnot Forums
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Thankyou Bernard. I was actually holding on to that one until winny the poo had dug a deeper hole.

 

[SUNRAY]

I think this whole argument is about the bit of cable (usually flex) from the cooking appliance(s) to the fixed installation. If that has a high enough CSA to be adequately protected by a 32A OPD (which is unlikley), and assuming the fixed cabling of circuit was OK for 32A, then a 32A OPD would be OK in terms of cable protection. Sunray appears to be saying that if that flex/whatever is only adequate for 16A, then a 16A OPD is required because of the (extremely small) probability of the 'partial short'.

Oh yes totally John, but winny the poo has disregarded those points I've made and seems to think he can chop and choose which bit of cable to protect.

 

[bernardgreen]

What are the odds that Winny will come back and say the manufacturer's instructions are wrong.

 

[SUNRAY]

What are the odds that Winny will come back and say the manufacturer's instructions are wrong.

10:1

 

[winston1]

Remove the link between the two L terminations and then two separate cables from two separate over current protection devices ( MCB ) can be connected the one appliance.

DIYnot.com
AEG Cooker CCB6761ACB Fitting query | DIYnot Forums
https://www.diynot.com/diy/attachments/189314/

Why do they they put the links in if it is felt 2 different OCRs are required?

 

[bernardgreen]

Winston. Please try and think with an open mind. You could learn enough to make your posts useful.

The appliance can be supplied by a single Live ( link fitted ) or by two separate Lives ( Link not fitted )

The two separate Lives can be two phases normal three phase ( 120° phase angle ) or split single phase ( 180° phase angle )

The two separate Lives could be from the same source and individually switched to enable some of the cooker element being disabled to reduce load on the supply.

 

[winston1]

The appliance can be supplied by a single Live ( link fitted ) or by two separate Lives ( Link not fitted )

The two separate Lives can be two phases normal three phase ( 120° phase angle ) or split single phase ( 180° phase angle )

The two separate Lives could be from the same source and individually switched to enable some of the cooker element being disabled to reduce load on the supply.

I understand all that. But people on here are insisting that an oven cannot go on a 32 amp circuit. Therefore a cooker which is an oven and a hob in one box must be on separate 16 amp circuits. If this is the case (I know it isn't but some on here think it is) why are the links provided?

I know the answer and that is that those that think on oven has to go on a 16amp circuit are wrong.

 

[SUNRAY]

.

Winston. Please try and think with an open mind. You could learn enough to make your posts useful.

My first thought to this was 'Yeah right, 2 hopes there'. BUT...

Sometimes winny comes up with some gems

such as:

The 13amp fused spur would be better near the socket in the house in my opinion.

1.5mm2 cable is oversized for the lighting, use 1.0mm2.

First para I agree with whole heartedly, but it's a shame the second para is only partially correct.

If fact thinking about it further it surprises me he hasn't commented the 6mm² is too big and should be smaller for a 16A requirement.

And these two, lovely clean & concise requests posts:

Do you mean 2 wires or 2 cables with several wires in each?

I think you mean 3 cables, 9 wires. Am I correct?

I haven't checked the quoted figures but they look very appropriate:

Overloading a ring is actually quite difficult. You need to take 32 amps within 15% of one end to do it assuming the ring cable is rated at 27 amps.

This one corrects anothers incorrect post in nice way:

T stands for terra, from the French for earth, not terrestrial.

An unexpected apology:

Sorry, I was confusing it with another thread.

Sensible advice/comments:

Don't use a junction box. Run a 3 core plus earth from the ceiling rose to the switch. Less connections and a short length of cable is cheaper than a junction box.

The so called LED alternatives use approx half the power and are half as bright. I replaced a 4 foot 36 watt tube with LED and the first comment I got from the other half was “why do dim?” So it went back and I got a standard fluorescent.

I don't regard replacing a "consumable" such as a florescent tube electrical work.

I hate it when I find myself thinking about a negative comment on good posts like those.

If only winny didn't keep coming out with so much utter crap in other posts he could possibly be a decent contributer.

 

[SUNRAY]

I understand all that. But people on here are insisting that an oven cannot go on a 32 amp circuit. Therefore a cooker which is an oven and a hob in one box must be on separate 16 amp circuits. If this is the case (I know it isn't but some on here think it is) why are the links provided?

I know the answer and that is that those that think on oven has to go on a 16amp circuit are wrong.

Who's saying that winston1?

 

[JohnW2]

I understand all that. But people on here are insisting that an oven cannot go on a 32 amp circuit.

I'm not agreeing with them, but I think you'll find that they are 'insisting' that it cannot do on a 32A circuit if the MI says that it must have 16A OPD protection (e.g. because it comes with a flex rated only for 16A).

Therefore a cooker which is an oven and a hob in one box must be on separate 16 amp circuits.

As above, I imagine they would only say that if the MI said that (although in the same box) the oven and hob each had to have (separate) 16A protection (which I very much doubt it would say).

 

[bernardgreen]

I understand all that. But people on here are insisting that an oven cannot go on a 32 amp circuit.

I think people are saying that if the cable that is supplied with the oven is rated at 16 Amps then protecting that cable with a 32 Amp MCB may result in the 16 Amp cable being overloaded in a fault situation.

 

[winston1]

I'm not agreeing with them, but I think you'll find that they are 'insisting' that it cannot do on a 32A circuit if the MI says that it must have 16A OPD protection (e.g. because it comes with a flex rated only for 16A).
As above, I imagine they would only say that if the MI said that (although in the same box) the oven and hob each had to have (separate) 16A protection (which I very much doubt it would say).

So why is an oven and hob (in separate boxes) traditionally wired to a 32 amp circuit? They always seem to come with 16 amp rated flex after all.

In a similar vein small appliances in Europe often come with 0.75mm2 flex and a plug that fits a 16 amp socket.

 

[bernardgreen]

So why is an oven and hob (in separate boxes) traditionally wired to a 32 amp circuit?

Maybe the installer has read somewhere that manufacturer's instructions are often wrong and can therefore be ignored.

 

[winston1]

Maybe the installer has read somewhere that manufacturer's instructions are often wrong and can therefore be ignored.

Ah, an installer who thinks for himself.